[rumble]https://rumble.com/embed/pj.vuknzz/[/rumble]
This is an extraordinary documentary. People would do well to keep this in mind when considering the unfolding of events presently in the Russ0-Ukraine conflict. On the ‘age-restriction’ above, having viewed the video, I have no idea why it is instituted apart from making the dissemination of this documentary more difficult.
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Doesn’t work for me in YT – Not surpising now that YT only allows the MSM narrative and is a cheerleader and cheif censor for the west’s left leaning viewpoint. We are in a phony WW3 after all. Rumble works – https://rumble.com/vx6u1x-donbass-2016-documentary.html
Go to Google Frogger and have a go there. I got it to work with English subtitles because although I can read a fair bit of Ruski I am slow at it.
Likewise, I could not download this documentary – server went into a frenzy & kept telling me to reload..reload.
However, from the New Catallaxy page itself I was able to download a clip purporting to show Ukrainian military tying the hands of captives (not Russian soldiers) behind their backs, while booting them in the head.
This clip was provided by Dover. Thank you Dover – it was a valuable indication of a theory I have that the Buchna victims were probably looters or collaborators shot by Ukrainian forces.
The fog of war. Military historians and analysts will do a lot with this footage, I suspect.
Thanks Frogger I will try to switch the video to Rumble shortly.
Now fixed.
Starting to look like we are the baddies.
Bruce, I was entertaining this title post: Are we the baddies?
Keep in mind, this is only a year or so into the conflict. The people of the Donbass have had 8 years of this without any sign of peace. And we’ve heard hardly anything about this in the MSM over the same period. I was alerted to this doco by the following tweet by war reporter, a French lass, excoriating the French MSM which has not cared about it or her reporting on the matter.
Yes, we are the baddies.
Although we know the baddies are actually the leadership, the corptocracy and media of the West.
We are ruled by evil people and most don’t realize it, living in ignorant bliss.
No one could watch this documentary and think the Ukro-Nazis are the good guys that we should be supporting.
You’d be a fool to continue taking anything the media says as true.
And thank you Dover for posting. It was very insightful and sobering
Good work Dover, there are always many facets to a crisis, and they should all be investigated. I do not like being prohibited from accessing Russian sites such as RT to get their side of the story about the Bucha massacre. My VPN just fakes from ‘western’ countries, all of which are blocked. The only thing confirmable is that in this recent matter a lot of innocent civilians were murdered and worse.
What touched me was the insistence by these Russian-speaking souls that they were Ukrainian and could not understand how their own government could be doing this.
Poroshenko’s words at the start perhaps give insight into how things were and are.
Can anybody doubt now that the only solution is separation?
There was another link posted by some one which showed what happened in Odessa.
Would that person please post it. This needs to be shown.
What I cannot get over is how the Russian mothers speak so lovingly to their children in times of war.
Compare that to how we talk to our children
I do not want to live here.
We are obsessed with trash , trannies etc full term abortions , and we will not defend our country.
That was on the table in February when Biden’s “minor incursion” gaffe inadvertently revealed the Western consensus that the Donbass was not worth a war over. Putin then overreached.
Odessa massacre in 2014.
https://www.bitchute.com/video/TSAJOYw59Xky/
It’s a bit rough, but not as rough with the videos coming out of Ukraine now, with the military turning against their own population and being killed point blank in their cars as collaborators for fleeing or attempting to flee, taking in humanitarian aid etc. Plenty of eyewitness accounts or uploaded phone footage from the people held hostage by their own military
My stomachs not strong enough for most of it. But you’ll find it unfiltered, and from the other side’s point of view. It’s on the Russian telegram channels like ColonelCassad. Requires many taps on the translate button.
In what sense is it confirmed?
I’ve seen maybe a dozen bodies on the street. That’s tragic but it is not a ‘genocide’ and may even be less worrying than a weekend in Chicago. Ukrainian civilians were ordered and armed to fight by Zelensky – the hero who doesn’t personally shoot at anyone. Maybe they died in the fighting. And where is the phone footage of the mass butchering of civilians? Why is there NEVER any film of each news cycle’s curated outrage out of Ukraine?
Far out! Officially approved thugs committing violence in the cause of the government. The police stay out of it. There’s a lot of that about these days (though not quite to that extent in the West … yet).
Thanks Frogger. Sobering.
Thanks Dover, and of course this was 2016 and those people endured a further six years before the Russian invasion.
Roger – an ‘official’ Russian military incursion into the Donbas, as distinct from supporting the separatists, would have presented other issues. As it was, the Ukrainian military were shelling the various towns and this often seemed to occur despite little evidence the separatists were nearby. It was to intimidate the locals and damage services such as water and power hoping that many locals would leave and thereby reduce support/services the separatists could utilise.
A Russian military invasion confined to the Donbas would have presented a significant and largely static target in a relatively confined area for the Ukrainian military who could move their assets around well outside of the Donbas whilst the Russian military would have been mainly ‘stuck’ in specific cities/districts. Western military would have delighted in providing the Ukrainians with satellite and other intelligence data on the location of Russian assets, not to mention long range missiles, and the Ukrainians would have pummeled them relentlessly.
Sooner or later, the Russian military would have tired of being a punching bag for the Ukrainian military and would have retaliated against the Ukrainian missile launch sites whereby the Ukrainians would have screeched about Russian escalation.
Separately, it wouldn’t have addressed the larger question of Ukrainian membership to NATO and in any case the Donbas, even if the Ukrainians accepted it to be an independent ‘Federation’, isn’t big enough to be a sufficient buffer.
Because diversity + proximity = war.
And these are only two tribes. How many do we now have in Australia? What happens when our economic faux miracle comes crashing to the ground under its own weight of lies and desperate people begin to look for quick and easy answers?
It will make Ukraine look like a picnic.
It’s probably shameful for me ask these questions, but nevertheless, I will take this shame in my stride and ask the questions anyway; what was the purpose, or point, of any ‘Allied’ blood being spilt in Europe in WWII if the same ‘Allies’ are now funding and militarising (arming) the same fucking murderous arseholes whom the blood was shed to defeat ?
To me it’s inexplicable why NATO and the U.S would seek the services of Ukrainian Nazis to ultimately and violently weaponize the 2014 Maidan protests/coup and; to think that these very same Nazis would not be politically and militarily incorporated to be the protectors of the now Western aligned Ukraine Government and to violently put down any opposition ?
On what possible planet, or parallel universe, did NATO and the U.S not think that at some point in time someone, anyone, would not forcefully challenge the resurgence of a political and fully militarised Nazi enterprise within earshot of a major nuclear power ?
Should NATO and the U.S be held to the same standards of ‘Justification’ that they (NATO/U.S) posit on other sovereign Nations for a militarised dispute resolution ?
Can NATO and the U.S spell the word hypocrisy without farting the words ‘New World Order’ at the same time ?
The doco is 2016 but the footage is from 2014 and 2015. Many of those interviewed have no idea this is going to drag-on for so long with little Western interest.
On the contrary, it is precisely because of Western interest, very close Western interest, that this has dragged on for so long.
Yes, I see what you’ve done there.
Why is there NEVER any film of each news cycle’s curated outrage out of Ukraine?
The Russians have denied direct responsibility and have suggested they may have been artillery casualties and have requested some form of independent investigation. “The tragic civilian deaths must be assessed honestly, not used to fuel the information war”
https://www.rt.com/russia/553323-deaths-civilians-ukraine-bucha/
(this RT link works i think)
Some of the footage I saw had bodies with their hands tied behind their backs. This is not proof that the Russians were torturing civilians, and could be a ruse created by Ukrainian militia. Either way, there were a lot of murdered civilians.
No basis for drawing that conclusion.
All we know for sure is that Ukraine has changed it’s story on how long the bodies were in the streets and the U.K. doesn’t want an investigation.
Thanks Frogger – I am going to send this around as why Putin seized Odessa.
Century of underlying hatred exploited.
If this is what Putins is rescuing then that is heroic. Then why wait 8 years .
I think he is going to hold the land gains to transport the nickel and cobalt to the Mariupol steel mill.
The Russians will then supply the steel for the inter continental railway.
What could be worse for the democrats , a skilled activity opening up a large land mass uniting a number of countries moving hard product and people across this expanse.
This will unite a significant amount of the worlds population.
Improving standards of living.
This should usher co operation and peace as these different countries go on their daily business.
What are we doing. Name calling and yelling at everyone . Only aspiration is to be on talk show.