Let’s be pessimistic or is it realistic. Suppose the Voice gets up in the referendum.
We’ll have thirty-five local and regional bodies coalescing into either state and territory bodies from which twenty-four reps will emerge to form the Voice. Or at least that’s the proposed model in the Calma-Langton report.
It’s an opaque process. Probably controlled by the usual suspects. It’s the opposite of an open selection process in which electors choose their representative by secret ballot, overseen on the national stage by the AEC. There is a stock-standard pledge by incoming leaders following the conclusion of this process. I’ll govern for everyone not just those who voted for me. Whether this proves to be the case or not, we all know who the everyone is.
Who is the everyone that the Voice will purport to represent? Is it the 812,728 who self-identified as Aboriginal or Torres Strait Islanders in the last (2021) Census? I suggest that many of those would not be recognised as Aboriginal or Torres Strait Islanders by other Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islanders. Hmm?
So how many people would the Voice represent? Unknown.
Is there a way of identifying with clarity those who the Voice would represent? Unknown or not remotely likely; take your pick.
Could those people, if identifiable, vote out Voice representatives? No.
Is there a way of judging whether the Voice will adequately reflect the interests of those it purports to represent? No, because there are no elections and, to reiterate, those that it purports to represent can’t be collectively defined with any precision.
Let’s be clear. The proposition to be put to the Australian people (including those who might or might not be recognized as Aboriginal or Torres Strait Islanders) is that we attach to the Constitution a representative body to represent an unknown subset of the Australian population who, even if we could ever define them with precision, will have no say through the ballot box in who represents them. That sounds sensible. Let’s vote for that. Sadly, the likelihood seems to be that a majority will. That would say something about the majority’s common sense. Mind you, it would say nothing that hasn’t been evident these past years. Think of the gullible embrace of the climate-change hoax and the enthusiastic rush to embrace Covid lockdowns, experimental vaccines and useless masks. The Voice will be a shoo-in, I fear.
Peter, some time ago Sydney Institute hosted an address by George Williams on the proposition of The Voice. In spite of his best efforts to promote the idea, it seemed that he thought it very unlikely to “get up.” He appeared to groan when I raised the example of ATSIC as a failed body “representative” of the indigenous community.
My, how things have changed. A concerted effort by every Woke entity in the country is, in my opinion, shifting the balance towards a successful vote ie YES. It just goes to show you the impact of emotion, rather than reason, on debate in this country these days. So depressing.
I don’t believe it will be a shoo-in. Seniors will vote it down. Till the next time.
I’m guessing most Aussies are not interested in it. Maybe apathy will allow it to get over the line if a lot of people choose not to vote. Let’s not forget that there is a very high proportion of stupid people in our society.
Baa.
Elitism: German Health Minister Karl Lauterbach Views The Voting Public As A Flock Of Sheep (15 Jan)
That’s how Albo looks on the proles regarding the Voice. Tell them nothing, get them to vote on their feelz, then write the legislation just how they want.
The prospect of this outrageous proposal getting up is truly frightening.
I have decided, on this my 70th birthday, to be a calmly determined, and if necessary controlled aggressive, conservative. It is clearly impossible to use rational thinking, facts and sound argument against those who use emotion and ill-informed ‘facts’ to arrive at their position. I will happily say to their face that the strength of their feelings does not equate to the strength of their ‘argument’. Should this ‘Voice’ be endorsed by Australian voters, it will, in my view, fracture this society beyond repair. It’s long past the time when we conservatives need to stand up for what we know is right. This ‘Voice’ thing is so very wrong in principle that is has become, for me, a hill to die on.
I’m sure I will lose friends and family over this stand – so be it then.
End of rant.
We have seen too many non-sensible (disastrous?) ideas transformed into policy and then legislation to have any faith that The Voice will be treated as it should be – consigned to the bin asap.
I hope I’m proved wrong, but I think the “Voice” will be a “shoo -in.” All those Millennials who have never actually met an Aborigine, but they all saw “Rabbit Proof Fence” at school…
“Christinesays:
January 16, 2023 at 5:00 pm
I don’t believe it will be a shoo-in. Seniors will vote it down. Till the next time.”
Agree Christine…..but recent migrants will also vote it down. They’re not loaded down with “white guilt”.
“Mak Siccarsays:
January 16, 2023 at 6:10 pm
The prospect of this outrageous proposal getting up is truly frightening.
I have decided, on this my 70th birthday, to be a calmly determined, and if necessary controlled aggressive, conservative. It is clearly impossible to use rational thinking, facts and sound argument against those who use emotion and ill-informed ‘facts’ to arrive at their position. I will happily say to their face that the strength of their feelings does not equate to the strength of their ‘argument’. Should this ‘Voice’ be endorsed by Australian voters, it will, in my view, fracture this society beyond repair. It’s long past the time when we conservatives need to stand up for what we know is right. This ‘Voice’ thing is so very wrong in principle that is has become, for me, a hill to die on.
I’m sure I will lose friends and family over this stand – so be it then.
End of rant.”
Amen.
This Race based referendum is a shocker. The idea of giving preferential treatment to a “race” was abhorrent not so long ago, once called apartheid.
Matters peripheral to the above, there are many more.
– Definition of aborigine please.
– Aborigines already have their voice with 11 aboriginal Parliamentarians.
– Parliamentarians can be democratically voted out every few years what about these 24 “representatives” who will probably be the activist names we all know.
– Albanese stated it would be a brave government who ignored the Voice recommendations.
– Government proposals paralysed as High Court adjudicates on Constitutuonal ramifications of “voice” recommendations.
– ATSIC was a disaster and abandoned as corruption and waste took over. History will no doubt repeat itself.
Non aboriginal citizens resentful at watching money being spent on preferential treatment of purported aborigines and the resultant empire building. Division on a grand scale guaranteed.
The AEC would need to start asking voters if they are Aboriginal or Torres Straight Islander.
May I suggest, as a protest, that everyone tick the box marked yes for that one?
Its the Vibe. A shoo in for certain. The public is not the slightest bit interested in the detail.
No one reads the papers. Hardly anyone watches the news except for the sports bit.
Have you ever looked at the online news and social media stuff. Total progressive slant and NO coverage of anything that reflects badly on their side.
The voice is part of the new Holy Trinity” Green, Identity, Victimhood.
There was a very big protest in Federation Square Melb. a few years back , protest W.A libs trying to close down remote hell-holes in the bush hundreds of miles from any services or anything. Jobs especially.
Then they all went off to the bars , the trendy laneways and heaps of restaurants all around them after having shown that far distant W.A government their superior virtue.
They really think their virtue signaling is all that’s required. After all, it freed all those girls captured by Boko Haram did’nt it?
I remember those protests – the “Warriors of the Aboriginal Resistance” – the majority of whom were fair skinned, blonde haired and blue eyed – shut down the C.B.D. of Melbourne in protest. Kimberly Aborigines would have said that their mothers “bin eatem white bread.”
The precedent was set with SSM, not a plebiscite but a postal survey. They’ll do the same again. Lots of votes will be invalidated to get it across the line. Not being able to climb Ayers Rock, walk up Mt Waring or sail Lake Eyre will be small potatoes to what’s coming. Might have to turn on 5G to prevent it.
Bet the government can’t even (or want to) define who is an Aborigine.
Too “racist.”
When anyone ticks one of the boxes as being of Aboriginal or TSI descent for special privileges or benefits, is his or her background even checked to determine if they are being truthful?
Again, I bet not; too “racist.”
And yet the government is desperate to get the Voice up to advantage solely this demographic of society.
No to the racist Voice!
These points should turn off many who would vote “yes” when they understand the elitist self-serving structural flaws. As well as the obvious “no” campaign because of the inherrent racism of it, the flaws in the proposed system should be better publicised.
The voice is a political joke and that will get it elected . Lots of it about these days….
If we all did this the whole thing would fall over very quickly.
eMay I suggest, as a protest, that everyone tick the box marked yes for that one?
If we all did this the whole thing would fall over very quickly.
Even if 10% of plucky pale proles did fudge their way into first nationses, it’d send the whole charade down the gurgler.
But, as I learned with my appeals that 10% non-compliance with the Wuhan Flu lockdowns would be too much for the ruling class to ignore, there’s a distinct lack of irreverence in the Australian public.
Every controversial issue with which the Voice disagrees will end up in the High Court. So much for representative democracy.
I’m assuming “reparations “ will be one of the first cabs of the rank followed by treaty negotiations.
There’s a lot of people who are new to Australia, in the last 60 or 70 years, who don’t feel any obligation whatsoever to any guilt for the British past here. They tune out of all the browbeating from the likes of the ABC and similar, it doesn’t apply to them. They were welcomed as migrants and refugees to a new home that was free and democratic.
They frown on the freeloaders and know them for what they are. They see those who want a free ride, to have a different system because the current democratic one doesn’t suit them. It is obvious it is all about prestige for a few and money for the masses of freeloaders to get them to go along with it. There is nothing about improving the lot of those who need it, it’s all about the mob at the top, again.
We will all vote for what they really think, not what we are told to think, and get what we deserve.
If the referendum fails, it will just go another and another round till it gets up. The lack of honesty in our politicians and journalists is dissappointing.
Its a shadow government.
State, local, federal and territory.
Its in the langton report, representations to influence all 3 levels of government.
You think planning permissions are drawn out/expensive & illogical now, wait till you disturb a waggyl or a “birthing tree”.
We are seeing yet another example of why a colonising force should either genocide or forcibly integrate/assimilate the native population…
There would be no such discussion underway if Australia had been colonised by the Spanish instead of the British.
The so called “Blak [sic] Greens” are already saying they will oppose it unless there’s a treaty attached …
So there are grounds for hope.
Or, had Australia been occupied by the Japanese…….