Open Thread – Tues 21 Feb 2023

Purgatory Canto 33, Gustave Dore, mid-1800s

2,049 responses to “Open Thread – Tues 21 Feb 2023”

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  1. JC Avatar

    Initially I’d agree with you, although it was evident from the beginning that she differed from the other upper class twits. The night up a tree surrounded by lions and then surrounded by sharks in the middle of the Suez proved she was of the right stuff.

    Are you kidding, The girl is a complete head case. She is about to get married and jilts her future husband just before the wedding. She gets rooted all over Africa, has to jump into a tree to avoid being meat for lions, and then survives an accident at sea. She’s also annoying as hell in that ditzy way she acts. No thanks, she’s all yours, Cronkite. Right stuff alright! Wake up.

  2. OldOzzie Avatar

    Elizabeth (Lizzie) Beare says:
    February 24, 2023 at 7:16 pm

    but please don’t direct others to give it to me.

    Apologies Calli, for any personal invasion you felt by my comment.
    I will regard your name as off limits in any comment I make from now on.

    There are a huge number of well-off others Joh could look to denigrating; that was my point.

    I find it very tiresome to have such nonsense directed constantly towards me, that’s all.


    not sure why I rated a mention, but Hey Life is Good

    growing up in a Single Female Parent household after my Father died when I was 14 Months old – I appreciate the Loneliness and Hardship my Mother endured to give my Sister & myself a Private Education, and a life filled with Love

    How my Mother survived me, my Wife does not have a clue – she believes I am totally ADHD, definitely correct – attention span of a Dead Duck – but great at IQ tests and fell into IT dropping out after 4 enjoyable years at Sydney Uni doing Civil/Chemical Engineering, to join IBM

    But I met my Wife in 1965 as I dropped out of Uni, when she was 18 and I was 20, won the 1st Ballot for Vietnam, bought a block of land together 18 Months later & married when I was 22 & she was 20

    As both our Parents were poor, we paid for the Whole Wedding – Church, Hire Cars, Wedding Dress, Going Away Outfit & Bridesmaids/Grooms outfits, Wedding Reception, Food , Grog etc

    The day after we got married, we packed all our worldy belongings into a 1961 Hillman Minx SelElectric Auto Transmission to head to Melbourne to start a new life – with about 200 pounds in cash as our only money

    Hard concept to explain to our kids when they were getting married and we paid

    Life has treated me well and I am blessed with 3 kids (we lost a boy, died at birth) & 9 Great Grandkids

    I have the joy of having the Oncologist tell me yesterday, that the Cancer Immunotherapy has worked and Head & Neck Cancer is in remission, and other than my CLL of 23 years still boumcing along, I am fine – more importantly the Cancer Immunotherapy Drug Trial I was on, was succesful for the other participants, and from October 2022 the Immunotherapy Drug is now on PBS

    My Wife, whose Stonemason Father has Very High Cholesterol that she has inherited, was upset that my Cholesterol was 2.7 given Alcohol, Fatty Steaks, Salt etc, all that is bad

    So I have the Joy of living with my Wife, my Youngest Daughter Son-in-law & Grandkids 7/8/9 – 6/9/11 Years who regard me as the Mad Nonno

    11 year old was describing Year 6 Debating with External School tonight, where he was part of the team (last week 3rd speaker and laid them out in the aisles & won) but as a support during the prep period

    Topic that We need to stop eating Meat – the other team was the Afirmative and his Team lost

    He gave his team a post assesment as to why they had lost

    He said that the Affirmative started off with that Cows emit Methane and should be put down

    I said the rebuttal should have been “You Fart & Pollute, so when are you going to put yourselves Down”

    Grandsons Loved, but Wife & Daughter not Happy

    I enjoy Dover’s blog, because it exercises my mind and keep the”Little Grey Cells Alive” to quote Piorot – I try to avoid getting into personal attacks, as I think it detracts from the philosphy of the blog

    I follow up peoples links because I belive they put them there for a reason

    To Dover – thank you for allowing me to particpate on your Blog – Much appreciated

  3. areff Avatar

    Sitting here, doing the Lord’s work at the keyboard altar of truth and …. a huntsman (I think) drops right on my head.

    It was kinda spindly to be a huntsman. Do huntsman lower themselves on silken threads? This one did.

    It’s now lurking somewhere behind the office chair. If it doesn’t get up the wall quick smart the cat will have it for a midnight snack.

  4. rosie Avatar

    1834 all monasteries and convents in Spain were confiscated and many sold to become jam or canning factories erc.
    Religious life was forbidden.
    I don’t think they murdered clerics though, that was a Republican speciality.

  5. MatrixTransform Avatar

    Do huntsman lower themselves on silken threads?

    they can, yes.

    I once watched one do exactly that

    and then hanging from a tread, proceed to shed it’s exoskeleton


  6. Top Ender Avatar
    Top Ender

    Vikki Campion: Officer Zach Rolfe is not the bad guy for killing Kumanjayi Walker

    Kumanjayi Walker was a violent offender who was shot dead after stabbing police officer Zach Rolfe and threatening his partner’s life. How has this monster been turned into a martyr, asks Vikki Campion.

    The Saturday Telegraph

    It is beyond belief that, in 2023, Australians are asking to spear a police officer for doing his job, and disgusting that a coroner could be perceived to entertain that thought by not refuting it whilst standing beside them.

    The same coroner on Monday will examine the circumstances surrounding Kumanjayi Charles Arnold Walker’s death, a violent offender, who amongst a litany of crimes was shot after stabbing police officer Zach Rolfe and threatening his partner’s life.

    How would spearing another member of the Rolfe family do anything for the Northern Territory town of Yuendumu but take it to new level of a Dante’s hell?

    Rolfe’s family have pondered this since the coroner stood beside elders and allowed them to call for traditional payback, the spearing of both his legs.

    “We want to see justice — we have not seen the blood of Zach Rolfe,” they said.

    While Yuendumu demands blood for the death of Kumanjayi Walker, what’s been absent is demands for justice for those, including children, who suffered at his hands.

    His violent history has been mischievously set aside in the hype. From a monster to a martyr.

    What should be heard during the coronial inquiry is evidence from the one person who could shed light on Walker’s mindset on the night he died — an underaged girl and frequent victim of his rage, beaten with rocks, fists and feet, who was with him the day he escaped from a drug and alcohol centre until the fateful hour when, after stabbing a cop, he was shot.

    What should be shown is the 70 minutes of footage of a wounded and shocked Rolfe desperately trying to save Walker’s life with army medical training.

    What should be disclosed is that when the ambulance came to the scene to try to save Walker’s life, a paramedic was knocked out in a hail of projectiles. She hid under a desk in the police station that night, surrounded by police, and still thought she was going to die.

    The coroner has never admonished or reprimanded the community in their actions attacking first responders.

    One would assume a fulsome disclosure of all the facts, not the selection of a few to sensationalise and misinform the public are relevant.

    It should disclose nurses were extracted from Yuendumu for their own safety.

    What should be examined is how the Yuendumu community failed Walker from birth and failed those he brutalised in his violent history.

    What the coroner should investigate is why former chief minister Michael Gunner and police minister Nicole Manison, both former Labor staffers, flew into the emotionally charged community two days after Walker’s death and warned: “Consequences will flow.”

    How incendiary.

    As a former adviser to an experienced police minister myself, it is beyond belief they would inflame sensitivities during any ongoing investigation.

    They weren’t there at the time and were either selective or ignorant of the facts. They only understood the politics they were playing — to frame it as a George Floyd incident.

    Instead of a full investigation, the political Zeitgeist of urban Australia demanded pillorying Rolfe, resulting in buried evidence, manipulated facts and leaking his name to the public while he remained stabbed and shocked.

    Not 72 hours earlier, Walker had charged at officers with an axe.

    Instead, what you will hear is selected text messages from a compendium of more than 5000, seized and extracted without a warrant.

    People in the trenches, under fire, talk in brutal ways. It is a means of steeling themselves through circumstances most of us cannot handle.

    When someone has to remove a molested child from their family, their language becomes battle-scarred. It doesn’t mean they are criminals.

    Rolfe knows it is wrong and has apologised for it.

    Over the past few weeks, evidence given to the federal Joint Standing Committee on Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Affairs has told the same story, from remote community to remote community: We call the police, but they don’t come.

    Can you blame them? To save this person, I might be the one who gets a life sentence. Is it worth it?

    Consider the attrition rate of the Northern Territory Police since Commissioner Jamie Chalker came to power, whose lack of procedural fairness and justice for Rolfe has led to a mass exodus.

    When the Rolfe family has been subject to death threats, ask yourself, would you send your son or daughter to Yuendumu to be a police officer or a nurse, where health workers now live under 24/7 security?

    You have seconds to choose if you live or die as a police officer — not enough time to consider an offender’s race, background or culture.

    Rolfe finally spoke out this week, knowing doing so could lead to prison time and another disciplinary notice — and only because Commissioner Chalker sacked a senior officer who defended him.

    He is screaming for a reality check on our Hollywood appraisal of a situation we would not be able to live in, let alone manage.

    What was his alternative? To let chaos reign supreme or let him and his partner be killed?

    In his own words: “You don’t see me on duty finding children at 3am, in breach of their bail in the city; you don’t see me talking to them and asking why they’re there only to find out they haven’t had a proper meal in days. You don’t see me instead of arresting them, taking them home past a 24-hour service station and buying them a meal, letting them choose some lollies as long as they choose something healthy.

    “You don’t see me take that kid to a home full of drunks, find one sober grandma in a back room to leave the child with and watch as the first thing that child does is offer to share her food with her grandma after being hungry for days, you don’t see how that breaks my heart, good kids being failed by their families.

    “You don’t see me hug the suicidal 12-year-old boy for an hour in the hospital to restrain him as he tries to harm himself; once he finally falls asleep, you don’t see me go into the town camps by myself in the middle of the night looking for a sober family member, only to find his parents drunk and refusing to assist their son, you don’t see me going door to door until I finally find a grandma who’s sober enough to come to the hospital, you don’t see the tears in the boy’s eyes as he sees a family member who actually cares enough to come.”

    Rolfe’s letter is to us.

    It could have been written by so many other frontline workers in remote communities and poses a fundamental question, are you going to back them in, or do the job yourself?

    Daily Tele

  7. OldOzzie Avatar

    rosie says:
    February 24, 2023 at 11:20 pm

    1834 all monasteries and convents in Spain were confiscated and many sold to become jam or canning factories erc.
    Religious life was forbidden.
    I don’t think they murdered clerics though, that was a Republican speciality.


    My Wife and I drove in our Harry Potter Ford Anglia, from Lourdes via back roads over the Pyrenees to Zaragoza to Madrid, across to Valencia then up through Barcelona to France in 1970 when it was under Franco – we were camping with a 2 man pup tent

    We went back in 1973, still under Franco’s rule, with 18 Month old son flew into Madrid, then drove Toledo, Cordoba, Granda, Malaga, Gibaltar (unable to get to British side) Cadiiz, Serville then Potugal back to Madrid, and we discovered Pardores, but having troubles changing Australian Dollars Travellers, alternated between 1 star Hostels (Hovels) and Parodores

    Comparing Spain under Franco to later 80s, 90s, 00s, and 2018, it was Donkeys & Peasants to Modern Euro Paid Highways in 2018

  8. rosie Avatar

    Wow OO, that must have been an adventure.
    I think Beevor mentions that Francos policies of nationalisation held Spain back like a satellite communist country.
    But Republican would have been worse.

  9. Elizabeth (Lizzie) Beare Avatar
    Elizabeth (Lizzie) Beare

    Were you being /sarc?

    No, Gabor. Just bringing to BG’s attention that he had us all waiting on his next moves, his next piece, recounting a personal experience, albeit of travel which intrinsically adds some spice, when he had just said he eschews such personal things.

    Partly, we were all entranced that such a dour fellow could be having such a fun set of complicated relationships. Maybe he’s not so dour after all. 🙂

    Maybe I am quite different IRL to what some here might expect too. I write because I need to write.
    It’s a driver for me. I have a lot of personal restraint IRL (some of the time anyway) . I enjoy meeting Cats IRL because of the far more rounded perspective that offers on their personalities, while one still sees the Cat persona there too.

  10. rosie Avatar

    No shortage of salad in Spain, if the British are feeling desperate for iceberg lettuce.
    And there must be plenty more squid in the sea.

  11. DrBeauGan Avatar

    Partly, we were all entranced that such a dour fellow could be having such a fun set of complicated relationships. Maybe he’s not so dour after all. ?

    Much dourer.

  12. Elizabeth (Lizzie) Beare Avatar
    Elizabeth (Lizzie) Beare

    Talking of personalities, we watched James Morrow’s The US Report on Sky tonight, which is always good. It concentrated a lot on showing the early unofficial declarations of the work being put in by Trump and now by DeSantis in preparation for the start of the January Presidential Primaries. Trump did a Presidential-style visit to Palestine, Ohio, getting there before any senior Biden admin person, and showing concern for the clearly ongoing ecological disaster there after the train crash, all while Biden was strutting it out internationally in Kyev. DeSantis is attending conferences in New York and Chicago where he is carefully profiling himself to become more widely known, gaining strong media attention, which indicates his definite intention to run. Both men have unusual strengths, both are very impressive, and I don’t know which one I think would be best, though I suspect DeSantis is more electable.

    Help me out here.

  13. Elizabeth (Lizzie) Beare Avatar
    Elizabeth (Lizzie) Beare

    I will sleep on it. Good night.

  14. Zulu Kilo Two Alpha Avatar
    Zulu Kilo Two Alpha

    good kids being failed by their families.

    I’ve got relatives in a Wheatbelt town. At least twice a week, the Aboriginal kids from down the street come knocking on their door.

    “Dad’s hitting Mum again. Can we stay in your spare room?” Dad has a long record of domestic violence, and both Dad and Mum are “out of bed at 7 A.M., and opening the first can of the day at 9.A.M.”

  15. Oh come on Avatar
    Oh come on

    Throughout the coronial inquest, Coroner Elisabeth Armitage heard evidence of text exchanges with other officers uncovered on Constable Rolfe’s phone in which Mr Rolfe spoke of “towelling up locals” and other officers referred to “bush c**ns” and “n***as”.

    So other officers referred to “bush c**ns” and “n***as”, not Rolfe? The worst the ABC can ascribe to him – and you know it is the worst because if there was worse, they would have printed it – is “towelling up locals” (whatever that means, although it doesn’t seem prima facie racist). They know how tame this language is, which is why they included it alongside the stuff they wish he’d said in an effort to context-smear him.

    Okay, this guy’s being railroaded.

  16. JC Avatar

    Help me out here.

    Sure, that’s easy. Trump will be 78 years old. He’s too old. That’s just how it is.

  17. OldOzzie Avatar

    Both men have unusual strengths, both are very impressive, and I don’t know which one I think would be best, though I suspect DeSantis is more electable.

    Help me out here.

    Wary on De Santis read Sundance


  18. Elizabeth (Lizzie) Beare Avatar
    Elizabeth (Lizzie) Beare

    The Patios of Cordova, an abidingly beautiful memory, and good to go to sleep on.

    More restful than US politics. Thanks Rosie for the reminders of this gorgeous old town.

  19. JC Avatar

    We also shouldn’t discount Youngkin from Virginia. The quiet achiever.

  20. OldOzzie Avatar

    The Woman Behind The Wars

    The Making of a Warmonger

    I’ve got an interesting thread about Victoria Nuland to share with you, but before I do, a few quick updates on my previous post here.

    Now onto the Victoria Nuland thread.

  21. Sancho Panzer Avatar
    Sancho Panzer


    February 25, 2023 at 12:11 am

    We also shouldn’t discount Youngkin from Virginia. The quiet achiever.

    Youngkin is an idiot!
    Once drove a team of horses full tilt into a river.
    Or was that Bumpkin from Vermont?
    I forget.
    No matter …

  22. rosie Avatar

    I’m staying in apartment looking out onto one of the patios of Cordoba.
    Currently wandering around the cathedral, the only ‘mosque’ I ever intend to visit.
    If you haven’t been, go.
    It is splendid.

  23. rosie Avatar

    It isn’t the expanse it once was, because the first row of columns around the exterior have been enclosed as chapels and the centre under the dome now housed the high altar and the choir.

  24. Barking Toad Avatar
    Barking Toad

    The politically motivated Coroner Elisabeth Armitage is the type who would have nailed Lindy Chamberlain as guilty immediately. Her 15 minutes of fame will come back to bite.

    They’re always suss these people who don’t have their Christian name spelt properly.

  25. Indolent Avatar

    Yes, because reducing your air supply and rebreathing your waste plus bacteria is just what is needed to protect your heart.

    CBS: Soaring Heart Attacks Due to Lack of Masking

  26. shatterzzz Avatar

    Be a few folk sitting in prison cells with assault convictions wondering why they didn’t join Vic plod and get paid to do what they got convicted for doing .. FFS!

  27. Makka Avatar

    ‘This is NOT this child’s fault. He is NOT a threat’:

    It’s that ethnic group again.

  28. Makka Avatar

    Top 5 dirtiest US cities;

    Houston: Democratic Mayor Sylvester Turner

    Newark: Democratic Mayor Ras Baraka

    San Bernadino: Democratic Party-endorsed Mayor Helen Tran

    Detroit: Democratic Mayor Mike Duggan

    Jersey City: Democratic Mayor Steven Fulop

  29. Makka Avatar
  30. Old School Conservative Avatar
    Old School Conservative

    JC says:
    February 24, 2023 at 11:29 pm
    This made me burst out laughing.

    I almost feel guilty laughing and re-watching over and over.

  31. Old School Conservative Avatar
    Old School Conservative

    Tap Tap.
    Is there something wrong with this computer?
    No posts between 1.28am and 8.40am and, importantly, no Tom’s Toons.

  32. Zipster Avatar

    ‘This is NOT this child’s fault. He is NOT a threat’: Mental health advocate launches furious defense of 6’6” thug, 17, weighing 270lbs who had to be dragged off unconscious female teaching aide

    just a simple test of the skin color chart will show this

  33. Mark Bolton Avatar


    THX Mate… The Cat may not be friendly to conversation but it remains a great aggregator thanks to folks like your good self.

  34. Mark Bolton Avatar


    You too … digging through the Medjjja is tiresome.. Props to you for doing it so we dont have to quite so much…

  35. cohenite Avatar

    Top Ender
    Feb 24, 2023 11:26 PM
    Vikki Campion: Officer Zach Rolfe is not the bad guy for killing Kumanjayi Walker

    BJ did alright with this gal.

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