Open Thread – Wed 13 March 2024


Autumn thoughts, Arnold Böcklin, late 1800s

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Dot
Dot
March 13, 2024 11:58 am

You defining something as stupid doesn’t make it so, Dot.

I’m right in this case.

Somone like Pinochet, and “Rivers of Blood” isn’t going to “save” society or unf**k it at all.

Let’s say your right. What are you going to do? Go to an election on this?

“Our policy to save Australia is another Pinochet and Rivers of Blood”

FFS, the only party you’d beat would be the pro child abuse pardee.

Boambee John
Boambee John
March 13, 2024 12:01 pm

Dot

Honda has a way to weld aluminium

Welding aluminium has been around for decades.

Winston Smith
March 13, 2024 12:03 pm

Roger

Mar 13, 2024 10:31 AM
Israel, like Australia, should be making preparations for the time when the US no longer underwrites our security. It may come sooner than we think.

Yes. We’ll hold off any aggressor with a nuclear powered submarines.
(Does anyone know where we are up to on this?)

Morsie
Morsie
March 13, 2024 12:06 pm

Fascinating that the version of TikTok that China gets has kids doing science experiments etc and teh version we get is just feral.

Barking Toad
Barking Toad
March 13, 2024 12:07 pm

NSW Police commissioner Karen Webb sacks media chief (Tele, paywalled)

This Webb bloke must surely get the flick.

Bloody hopeless. A cock in a frock.

Boambee John
Boambee John
March 13, 2024 12:08 pm

Dot

Since you seem to want a more detailed response, herre are your words from 1114, interleaved with my comments.

This is more meta than you may consciously think. They were cheering on the possible murder of Dr Cardinal George Pell whilst in gaol, an innocent man set up by a proven perjurer and a corrupt employee of state-owned media. Look at the applause for the disenfranchisement of COVID dissenters.

Good to see that you accept that the possibility of blood in the streets is real. What has been done since Pell to reduce that risk?

Of course we should have zero tolerance of the incitement to violence and give non-citizens the boot after they’ve been in gaol for their crime.

Yet thousands of anti-Semites have been parading through our majoe cities since 7 October, screeching “Kill the Jews, gas the Jews, where’s the Jews”. What actions have been taken to stop these open incitements to violence? What actions are likely top be taken? None and zero. How do you propose to fix this?

If we merely enforced the law as it stands (and consistently held our standards up, well, we’d be better off.

That’s a bloody big “If”.

If this is all that you can offer, I do not expect things to get better soon, and they will almost certainly get worse. Try again.

Dr Faustus
Dr Faustus
March 13, 2024 12:09 pm

Potentially a land based carrier, forward operating zone in ME, but it already has these elsewhere in KSA, Turkey, and other Gulf States, to some extent. What else?

The interests of 6 million Jewish US citizens – occupying key roles in most parts of creative and productive society.

Plus a regional ally that is not KSA or Turkey.

Boambee John
Boambee John
March 13, 2024 12:11 pm

Dot

Partially agreeing with you is burying your head in the sand or throwing your hands up in the air.

A pious expression of hope.

Bruce of Newcastle
Bruce of Newcastle
March 13, 2024 12:12 pm

The sooner Netanhanyu is gone the faster solutions can be found to the land and security issues with Palestinians.

Very funny Alamak. There are no solutions to be found regarding the land and security issues with the Palis and there hasn’t been since 632 AD.

Alamak!
March 13, 2024 12:13 pm

What does Israel get from the US? Diplomatic support. Military support. Strategic depth. Financial support.
What does the US get from Israel?

Not a lot, to be brutally honest. Israel is like the Saudis in trying to make their enemy into our enemy and get us in the west fighting Iran which offers no strategic threat to us.

Arky
March 13, 2024 12:13 pm

Sintered wires and wire mesh composites are very strong.</blockquote
..
Focus Dot.
Pay attention to the main point.
You were convinced ten years ago that mass production 3D printing of entire vehicles would be a thing. And therefore my concerns about the loss of our industrial base was wrong.
No.
You were wrong.
3D printing has NOT, repeat NOT replaced other manufacturing processes in mass produced goods.
It was relevant because I foresaw a time when the West would be challenged militarily by the old communist bloc and we would require that manufacturing base.
Which has come true. See the current shortage of artillery shells and the covid supply chain F up.
What I predicted came true, what you thought would occur has not.

Alamak!
March 13, 2024 12:16 pm

The sooner Netanhanyu is gone the faster solutions can be found to the land and security issues with Palestinians.

Very funny Alamak. There are no solutions to be found regarding the land and security issues with the Palis and there hasn’t been since 632 AD.

And yet the Palestinians exist, still.

Winston Smith
March 13, 2024 12:20 pm

Dot:
This is what I said yesterday. You may not like it, but I stand by the entire reply to Johanna.

Winston Smith
Mar 12, 2024 9:47 AM
Johanna:
Part of the solution to the problem is the naming:
A radicalized left still buzzing with the background radiation of the Jeremy Corbyn era.
These people are not a harmless sector of the population – they are, in fact, a Revolutionary Communist Army with allies from the Muslim Diaspora.
They are not a collection of disgruntled teenagers and religious followers of Islam. They are an army of fanatics who state their aim is to overthrow the present governments and societies of the Enlightenment and replace it with an ideology that has never worked and has only ever produced heaps of skulls. It will then be overthrown by another Cult that has never worked and also only ever produces piles of skulls of the non Cultists.
And they are doing it with the connivance of the leaders of our society who were voted in to perform their stated duties, but who have decided it is an easier life to go along with the barbarians howling at the gates.
It is now at the point that it will take a Pinochet style of government and “Rivers of Blood” to save Western civilisation.
What is it about us that we are so politically naive as to the stated actions of our enemies?

You just hope we won’t have to do it.
Hope isn’t a plan, Dot. Only a madman would WANT a Pinochet treatment. Just remember we had the same option at the start of WW2 when after all the faffing around, knowing we would have to fight Hitler and Germany, we finally did so. Rivers of blood? That took lakes and oceans of blood to sort that lot out and all because we refused to accept reality in the period of ’34 – ’39.
Tell us how you are going to stop us getting to the point it will be necessary to go the full Pinochet. I’d be willing to read it.

Pogria
Pogria
March 13, 2024 12:21 pm
Bruce of Newcastle
Bruce of Newcastle
March 13, 2024 12:28 pm

And yet the Palestinians exist, still.

They’re Arabs of Mycenaean Greek heritage, at least the ones in Gaza are. Palestinians are a mythological species.

If they want to call themselves that I have no objection. If they want to live miserably that’s their choice. Gaza could’ve been the MENA version of Singapore. They were given that chance and chose…poorly.

Alamak!
March 13, 2024 12:30 pm

It is now at the point that it will take a Pinochet style of government and “Rivers of Blood” to save Western civilisation.

I am not sure that “western civilisation” should be saved if torture (20k or more) and killing people (more than 2000) is the required ‘solution’.

People who suggest these kind of extreme measures have usually been anywhere more dangerous than the local pub at closing time.

Vicki
Vicki
March 13, 2024 12:32 pm

No one here probably watches Q&A. The other night I accidentally tuned in. Besides an excruciating defence of the Palestinian claims of “genocide”, the show lurched into the question of the health of the global economy. I was astonished when some supposedly qualified bimbo claimed that claims the US & other governments print money to support Treasury is nonsense. And they all sagely nodded their heads!

It is horrible to watch the West not only skating blindly over thin ice, but actually believing, contrary to the signs, that all is AOK.

Winston Smith
March 13, 2024 12:35 pm

Dot:

Then why have a conversation? What was being discussed was a fruity idea that we need another Pinochet and Rivers of Blood to save our civlisation.

Note, Dot. I didn’t say “Need another Pinochet…” I said “get another Pinochet”…
Mar 12, 2024 7:38 PM

Disagree as you will, but history shows that when peoples backs are against the wall, they are capable of all sorts of atrocities.

You are mistaking my warning for a wish.

Farmer Gez
Farmer Gez
March 13, 2024 12:36 pm

Monty Monty Monty.
If only you had a grasp of issues instead of blather.
I did not say projects were “mandated” in REZ’s but since they are the chosen zones for large scale projects and the infrastructure to support these projects, this effectively means a company will not receive approval unless it is in the zone or in near proximity.
All projects have to get past planning approval and be gazetted by government.
Please try to keep up Monty

shatterzzz
March 13, 2024 12:37 pm

The sooner Netanhanyu is gone the faster solutions can be found to the land and security issues with Palestinians.

Theo nly solution is the “Bennie” one .. complete annihilation of HAMAS .. F**K Gaza .. there are NO innocents ……….!

Dot
Dot
March 13, 2024 12:41 pm

It was relevant because I foresaw a time when the West would be challenged militarily by the old communist bloc and we would require that manufacturing base.
Which has come true. See the current shortage of artillery shells and the covid supply chain F up.
What I predicted came true, what you thought would occur has not.

Actually no – bear with me.

Russia cannot produce anything in a meaningful way. Where are the T-14 Armata tanks?

I was promised “manufacturing cities!” that would crush the Ukraine. Thousands of T-14 Armata tanks would crush the Ukrainian Nazis and liberate Ukraine!

Fortunately we have much less to worry about than anticipated. They’ve made less than 20.

Now they’re buying shells from a slave labour powered North Korea.

duncanm
duncanm
March 13, 2024 12:42 pm

Dot,

the point you seem to be missing about 3D printing is the throughput and cost.

Yes – you can make a whole lot of stuff with 3D printing.

Very little of it makes economic sense in high volumes against casting, injection moulding, forging, machining, etc..

Even composite fibre structures don’t make economic sense to be 3D printed.

Dot
Dot
March 13, 2024 12:43 pm

You are mistaking my warning for a wish.

A warning about the future, that will save society, which cannot be saved in the present?

Hmmmmm

JC
JC
March 13, 2024 12:44 pm

Interesting, I recall the conversation, Dot. You never said that an entire car would come out of a 3D printing assembly line. You made a very astute comment, which Musk is trying now. Various components being 3D’d.

Here:

Elon Musk, Tesla’s CEO, has always been a fan of “unboxed” production: making large sub-units of a car and then snapping the modules together. The EV company was “gigacasting” a few big parts—using ultra-high pressure presses to mold these pieces—instead of hundreds of small ones long before rival automakers started thinking about it. Now Tesla is pushing the envelope further by testing even bigger presses to cast virtually the entire body of a car
Tesla’s secret new technique combines 3D printing and industrial sand, Reuters reported, citing five sources familiar with the process that is still under wraps.

Winston Smith
March 13, 2024 12:45 pm

I’ll let you think about that for a bit, Dot.
I have the carpeters coming next Monday and I have to move the movable shit out of the house into the garage so they can put the stuff down, so posting may be a bit slow.

GreyRanga
GreyRanga
March 13, 2024 12:45 pm

Can you cackle like your namesake alamak, or is it allahmak. River to the sea shall be Pali free.

Vicki
Vicki
March 13, 2024 12:46 pm

So Bruce, why do you think the Palestinians are of Mycenaean heritage? I haven’t heard that before. Certainly the Mycenaeans were settlers of the Aegean & travelled around & across to the continental mass to the east. The Phoenicians were also seafarers who plied the area. But the the people who occupied the area of modern day Israel and Jordan were Semitic people who didn’t exhibit the cultural characteristics of the pre Greeks on the other side of the Aegean.

On the other hand, after the cataclysmic fall of the Minoan civilisation I do think that many of these people emigrated – but I believe that migrated by sea to the west, not to the contested lands of the east.

Crossie
Crossie
March 13, 2024 12:48 pm

Pogria
Mar 13, 2024 12:28 PM
Talcum X has crossed that last hairline thread to go full retard.

Of course he would embrace Islam, there are no downsides. He will be able to indulge any misogynistic proclivities and all his anti-Semitic attitudes will be embraced.

Alamak!
March 13, 2024 12:53 pm

Can you cackle like your namesake alamak, or is it allahmak. River to the sea shall be Pali free.

witty stuff, GR …

😉

Tag is based on a slang word commonly used in Malaysia && Singapore

Dot
Dot
March 13, 2024 12:55 pm

Claiming 3D printing can’t operate at scale when it has low costs of switching production methods or between parts or components is a rather ambit claim. If you have economies of scope you may gain cost savings in multiple parts rather than just one but with less capital invested, but more expensive and technically advanced per unit.

It’s the speed and size of the additive production systems that matter.

At a large enough scale, the costs are comparable for most industrial products, regardless of the input. CAN it scale is the question, not how does scale operate.

The advantage lies in high levels of customisation acting like operating at scale and low switching costs & high degrees of QC observations along with reduced warehousing costs.

The barrier at present is learning and investment in new capital which hasn’t been deployed before.

Metal sintering vs casting or forging is interesting. The additive method is safer, more controllable and can be made on demand with minimal lead in times.

Arky
March 13, 2024 12:56 pm

Now they’re buying shells from a slave labour powered North Korea.

..
So the old communist bloc is out producing the West in artillery munitions.
You essentially just restated what I said.
But still manage to avoid the main point you got wrong.
Focus Dot.
You have yet to 3D print your car, a decade after our discussion.
How many further decades do you want to wait, and in the meantime what do you think China, Russia and North Korea will get up to?

Dot
Dot
March 13, 2024 1:01 pm

Musk looks like he’s doing it.

They are extremely ugly cars though.

Eggs on wheels. If you must get an EV, get something nice, like a Polestar.

Dr Faustus
Dr Faustus
March 13, 2024 1:02 pm

Which means that these interests are not easily transferable to another major power.

Well, probably not the US citizens.
But transfer of interests to another major power isn’t necessarily the whole concern.

Arky
March 13, 2024 1:06 pm

Claiming 3D printing can’t operate at scale when it has low costs of switching production methods or between parts or components is a rather ambit claim.

..
Depends what you mean by “scale”.
If by scale you mean every factory has a 3D printer to make prototypes and one off parts used on the production line such as jigs and tooling, then 3D printing has already scaled and is very, very cool.
If by scale you mean that you will 3D print ten thousand parts before assembling them to the final product, then no. There is no reason to do that. For example, take one of the plastic parts on your car’s steering column. You could 3D print the tens of thousands required for a mass produced car. But injection moulding them would be the cheapest and best way to make that many. If you were making a low production run of 500 or 1000 cars it might be more economical to 3D print those. You might also use the 3D printer to make a mould for the injection die. More likely however is that you outsource the manufacture of the die to your usual die maker who is quite proficient and low cost at making dies and already has the specialist equipment like CNzc machining and spark erosion machines to do so.

Arky
March 13, 2024 1:08 pm

CNC

Salvatore, Iron Publican
March 13, 2024 1:09 pm

Interesting, I recall the conversation

Alas you don’t have a happy record when it comes to “recollections”

duncanm
duncanm
March 13, 2024 1:09 pm

Dot,

don’t confuse the issue by bringing up customised, hard to machine, high cost, or low-volume / high flexibility parts.

Yes – we can all bring up the example of commercial aircraft jet engine components being 3D sintered, and rocket engine bodies being built in place, but they’re relatively low volume, and the complexity / cost benefit works in those situations.

We’re talking mass production here.. cookie cutting.. and 3D printing does not do the job.

I wouldn’t be surprised if Musk’s large casting process used 3D patterns or investment casting plugs.

duncanm
duncanm
March 13, 2024 1:12 pm

Snap Arky,

we’re on the same page.

btw Dot.. here’s an example of how you can scale up 3d printed/sintered metal parts.. but it ain’t high volume.

https://www.desktopmetal.com/products/production

Bruce of Newcastle
Bruce of Newcastle
March 13, 2024 1:20 pm

So Bruce, why do you think the Palestinians are of Mycenaean heritage? I haven’t heard that before.

Vicki – There was a DNA study not long ago, particularly of a graveyard in Ashkelon. It’s fun that the Sea Peoples turned out to have left their imprint and that people just don’t tend to move that much, not even on a timeline of millennia.

DNA shows Philistines, and modern-day Palestinians, were really European (2019)

Bit of controversy as you can imaging. Many many pixels have been spilt in anger. I had seen a study showing the current Gazan population has a lot of Southern European genetic heritage, but I can’t find that right now. It was in one of the science news reports though. I may be mistaken. But since the Palis like to big up their ancient heritage for political reasons this DNA data is certainly in play.

Bruce of Newcastle
Bruce of Newcastle
March 13, 2024 1:29 pm

Russia cannot produce anything in a meaningful way.

Nuts.

I’d say Russia have prioritized their production away from big beasts like the Armata and to stuff like drones and artillery ammunition. And glide bombs. Tanks have a place, but they’re being relegated to highly endangered secondary support roles in this war. Not cost effective, although it’s clear they can very valuably add the needed extra oomph for assaults like Avdiivka. For that I suspect a T-62 is just as good as an expensive T-14 though.

Dot
Dot
March 13, 2024 1:40 pm

don’t confuse the issue by bringing up customised, hard to machine, high cost, or low-volume / high flexibility parts.

That’s not confusing the issue at all. That’s one of the advantages it has.

Then it can switch back to producing a volume product (another advantage).

I’m not really sold on the scepticism of metal sintering for small sized parts.

The disadvantage is you need one more step or retooled refineries upstream.

An advantage is a very quick step replacing two slow steps in your plant that have a lack of precision and require additional support equipment to ensure consistent manufacturing techniques. An entirely consistent process leads to a narrower QC parameter set and less failures. The work of the CI engineer is mostly done. What you need there is reliability engineering and strict QA staff.

Obviously things like machining, blueing and shot peening can’t be 3D printed but they can be made modular and precisely using much of the same capital machinery/inspection technology; these processes would be minimised and methodically targeted as production parameters are better observed.

Boambee John
Boambee John
March 13, 2024 1:40 pm

Dot
Mar 13, 2024 12:43 PM
You are mistaking my warning for a wish.

A warning about the future, that will save society, which cannot be saved in the present?

Still waiting for your practical ideas about how to save society “in the present”.

Bruce of Newcastle
Bruce of Newcastle
March 13, 2024 1:41 pm

Going to be hard to replace him with Big Mike now.

President Joe Biden has won enough delegates to clinch the 2024 Democratic nomination (12 Mar)

I’m still fairly sure Jill has the keys to the voluminous dirt file Joe amassed over half a century. Epstein would be the least of it, going on what has oozed out into the open air from time to time.

m0nty
m0nty
March 13, 2024 1:47 pm

I showed that as soon as you are forced to match solar panels with a battery that dumping the wretched things and buying a generator is less expensive. That calc uses the standard financial analysis tools we all use in industry, namely NPV and IRR.

The situation has likely gotten worse since then since inflation and resource issues have increased the cost of batteries.

As usual Bruce, when you are losing the argument you try to shift the goalposts. Lazard was talking about grid-scale stuff, not home batteries.

Batteries have lagged behind industry hype for years, but they are progressing in the right direction, adding density and capacity. Meanwhile, the economics of nukes are only getting worse and worse.

Gina has given Dutton a rotten lemon of a policy to sell, and he’s a terrible salesman. He’s making Albo look statesmanlike in comparison.

John H.
John H.
March 13, 2024 1:47 pm

Bruce of Newcastle
Mar 13, 2024 1:29 PM
Russia cannot produce anything in a meaningful way.

Nuts.

I’d say Russia have prioritized their production away from big beasts like the Armata and to stuff like drones and artillery ammunition. And glide bombs. Tanks have a place, but they’re being relegated to highly endangered secondary support roles in this war. Not cost effective, although it’s clear they can very valuably add the needed extra oomph for assaults like Avdiivka. For that I suspect a T-62 is just as good as an expensive T-14 though.

When a Bradley mounted cannon can take out a T90 what is the point of more tanks. May as well use the old stock. The big problem is the loss of tank crews. When a Russian tank goes bang the crew is typically cooked.

Dot
Dot
March 13, 2024 1:49 pm

Welding aluminium has been around for decades.

Welding aluminium to steel hasn’t. This has been around for over a decade now but:

Additionally, the new process uses about half the amount of electricity as Metal Inert Gas welding, and the machinery it requires isn’t as large as that traditionally used for Friction Stir Welding – in fact, it can be attached to an industrial robot. The technique can also be used for aluminum-to-aluminum welding, without any hardware changes.

An all-steel chassis car won’t be around forever and this is compatible with traditional production line assembly and additive manufacturing, done at scale or not.

Dot
Dot
March 13, 2024 1:53 pm

Still waiting for your practical ideas about how to save society “in the present”.

Apart from saying “I agree with you, in part”, again:

Give people back personal responsibility and let them build their communities, have responsibility for their own children and build social capital again, don’t subsidise their personal choices and cut government back to a supervisory role, it shouldn’t be an economic actor for the most part.

Woke, DEI, etc., don’t exist in a vacuum. They’re legislated or subsidised and most people do not even realise this.

Bruce of Newcastle
Bruce of Newcastle
March 13, 2024 1:55 pm

As usual Bruce, when you are losing the argument you try to shift the goalposts. Lazard was talking about grid-scale stuff, not home batteries.

Moving the goalposts eh Monty? We have been talking about rooftop solar all morning.

I am pointing out that as soon as you do standard financial analysis like NPV the renewables die horribly because you have to pull in all the stuff the Left likes to hide, like poles and wires, storage and backup generation.

In industry we can’t get away with that. My project financials were always audited by someone, often an external engineering consultancy.

Betcha you’ve never done a NPV calc. It’s a standard function in Excel btw.

Black Ball
Black Ball
March 13, 2024 1:55 pm

Sorry if posted already but bus, meet media advisor:

NSW Police Commissioner Karen Webb has sacked her most senior media adviser just weeks after coming under fire for her press conference and TV performances over the Paddington deaths of Luke Davies and Jesse Baird.

Liz Deegan, who held the role of Executive Director of Public Affairs, was told by Commissioner Webb on Wednesday morning that her services were no longer required.

Ms Deegan held roles including at News Corp as an editor and with the NRL as chief corporate affairs officer over a lengthy career in the media industry, before joining the NSW Police Force last April.

As Ace Of Spades is wont to say about Kamala Toe, Deegan has failed to Position Webb For Success.
Fair to assume Webb herself won’t be around much longer.

Bruce of Newcastle
Bruce of Newcastle
March 13, 2024 2:02 pm

When a Bradley mounted cannon can take out a T90 what is the point of more tanks.

John – I was thinking of mentioning that – the Ukies seem to rather like the Bradleys. Flexibility and speed and hitting power over the now fairly mythical defenses of the Abrams they received. It sounds like the Abrams are doing OK, but. The news seems they’ve lost three so far, which is fairly light in the circumstances.

As I said: for an assault it probably doesn’t matter whether you use T-14s or T-62s, since you have to establish local superiority anyway. So the same goes with Bradleys vs Abrams – which would more favour fast and flexible Bradleys.

The evolving military equipment learnings are really interesting. Not good for the poor guys doing the testing though. The PBI always get the pointy end of the pineapple.

Pogria
Pogria
March 13, 2024 2:06 pm

Crossie,
I wasn’t in the least surprised at Talcum X joining the middle-eastern Circus. Only that it had taken him this long. I’d wager he has dropped the “I’m Blek”, persona. The Allen’s Snackbar crowd are not fond of darkies.

m0nty
m0nty
March 13, 2024 2:08 pm

You are a classic bullshitter, Bruce. Always dodging the issue.

Congrats on knowing how to use Excel.

Pogria
Pogria
March 13, 2024 2:09 pm

Upthread, a commenter had linked to an article about the Belgian pollie being sent to prison for privately receiving memes. I’m willing to go Public with a meme.

I give you, Parliament House. 😀

John H.
John H.
March 13, 2024 2:16 pm
Arky
March 13, 2024 2:19 pm

The whole distraction sideshow of “new tech will make the loss of manufacturing irrelevant” continues.
Amazing.
Dot, when we went from horses to motor cars we didn’t off shore all the cart manufacturers and say “we won’t need that anymore”.
For decades car manufacturers put bodies made by the cart makers on to their own chassis.
If the cart makers had been off shored 110 years ago we wouldn’t have Ford or Toyota. They absolutely relied on those guys.
Every part of the early cars except the engines and transmissions were developed by cart makers. Axles, hubs suspensions, wheels, bodies and interiors were all from the cart industry.
No one thought we didn’t need the entire old industries because of the development of the internal combustion engine.
The concealed hinges on your car doors today were invented by the chaps who made horse drawn coaches.
Over the decades those trades were incorporated into the car industry. They didn’t disappear, or get sold off to third world countries, they transformed and were incorporated into the new industry of auto making.
Along the way they adopted the new matériels and techniques suitable for vehicles capable of the high speeds introduced by internal combustion power.
If you keep on using new technology to excuse the leftist destruction of Western manufacturing power you will by the time we revisit this discussion in 2034, twenty years after you first made this argument, see clearly what should be obvious now: the world is full of some very nasty players and it’s best to be part of something bigger than yourself that has the capacity to produce sophisticated goods at a massive scale.
That is: one which manufactures.
If you were correct and we had managed to offload a bunch of obsolete tooling crap on the naive Chinese and we had a plan to replace it with an all new, much more efficient and betterer manufacturing industry I would say “you beaut”.
But come on. You don’t believe that at all. There is no plan.
If you think the future is solar powered, nice and polite 3D printed and gender neutral vegan friendly manufacturing, you are as bad as Monty.

Bruce of Newcastle
Bruce of Newcastle
March 13, 2024 2:22 pm

Congrats on knowing how to use Excel.

Before that 1-2-3 and 2020. I doubt you’ve even heard of 2020. Green text on black background. I used to do NPVs by hand. I preferred VB to C+ when they made that change, but the rule in our company was that no financial spreadsheet was allowed to have macros, for transparency reasons.

Have you ever done a NPV or IRR calc?

No Monty I am not a bullshitter, I have been doing project financial analysis for over thirty years. First time was in 1988. When you propose a project the first thing you get asked is is it economically feasible. So I had to be able to do that analysis.

I have direct personal experience of seeing climate people not doing that sort of analysis, and when I did a quick rough calc for them I was instantly persona non grata. They welshed on paying my invoice too. A bigger tell would be hard to experience.

Tom Atkinson
Tom Atkinson
March 13, 2024 2:23 pm

That idiot of a journalist, Paul Kelly, in today’s The Australian asks, “Who do you believe: Tony Abbott or Donald Trump?”.

Some quotes:

Abbott and Trump disagree on the nature of conservatism and the contemporary threat to democracies. Abbott sees the world at a hinge of history moment that demands leaders of moral courage and political strength. He criticises the sentiment of isolationist Republicans in the US congress seeking to terminate support for Ukraine – a sentiment Trump has relentlessly advanced.

Abbott says “hear, hear” to President Joe Biden’s State of the Union declaration on Ukraine: “I will not bow down.” Biden attacked Trump’s appeasement of Russian President Vladimir Putin, saying of Trump’s stance on Ukraine: “It’s outrageous, it’s dangerous and it’s unacceptable.”

In an interview with The Australian, Abbott said it was “absolutely critical” to stop Putin. “It’s critical for two reasons,” Abbott said. “Because Ukraine is a sovereign independent nation fighting to stay free and because if Putin wins in Ukraine at the very least there will be a new cold war in Europe and it’s hard to see Putin not lifting his gaze to other parts of former Greater Russia, such as Poland and the Baltic States.”

Trump, by contrast with Abbott, has long flirted with Putin. He called Putin’s invasion of Ukraine “genius”; claimed he could have talked Putin out of it; more recently said he would stop the war “within one day, 24 hours”, a hollow boast revealing Trump’s compulsion to abandon Ukraine; and bragged that he previously told a NATO leader unless their nation increased its defence spending then Trump would tell Putin’s Russia “to do whatever the hell they want” – that is, encourage Putin to attack a NATO ally.

There is no evidence that Trump actually made that statement (“do whatever the hell they want”), but that doesn’t stop Kelly.

I normally go with Abbott, but for this one, Paul Kelly, I believe Trump.

Dot
Dot
March 13, 2024 2:30 pm

Dot, when we went from horses to motor cars we didn’t off shore all the cart manufacturers and say “we won’t need that anymore”.

No one made PMV leave Australia. GM Holden received a subsidy to stay here ($270 mn) in 2012, then in 2013 declared they’d be out of here by 2017, despite promising to stay until 2022.

There is no plan and there shouldn’t be. We already make IFVs, drones and munitions without any planning other than procurement. Arguably we make naval ships…

In a real, no-bullshit world war, we get nuked anyway. Dead people can’t produce capital goods from flattened factories glowing from fallout.

Boambee John
Boambee John
March 13, 2024 2:31 pm

Dot
Mar 13, 2024 1:49 PM
Welding aluminium has been around for decades.

Welding aluminium to steel hasn’t. This has been around for over a decade now but:

That wasn’t your claim. Try to tell the full story the first go.

Boambee John
Boambee John
March 13, 2024 2:33 pm

Dot
Mar 13, 2024 1:53 PM
Still waiting for your practical ideas about how to save society “in the present”.

Apart from saying “I agree with you, in part”, again:

Give people back personal responsibility and let them build their communities, have responsibility for their own children and build social capital again, don’t subsidise their personal choices and cut government back to a supervisory role, it shouldn’t be an economic actor for the most part.

Woke, DEI, etc., don’t exist in a vacuum. They’re legislated or subsidised and most people do not even realise this.

This is a long way from fractious minorities inciting violence in the streets. Might I take it that you have no practical solutions to offer to that problem?

Boambee John
Boambee John
March 13, 2024 2:36 pm

m0nty
Mar 13, 2024 2:08 PM
You are a classic bullshitter, Bruce. Always dodging the issue.

Congrats on knowing how to use Excel.

Do you? The evidence that you can is minimal.

Boambee John
Boambee John
March 13, 2024 2:41 pm

Dot

There is no plan and there shouldn’t be. We already make IFVs, drones and munitions without any planning other than procurement. Arguably we make naval ships…

I don’t know much about Defence Procurement, but quite clearly, you know less.

WolfmanOz
March 13, 2024 2:41 pm

No movie post this week as I’m still in NZ seeing family.

Plan to resume next week with the first of a 2 part series with part 1 focusing on director Christopher Nolan to be followed up with part 2 with my review/take of the film Oppenheimer.

Dot
Dot
March 13, 2024 2:48 pm

Here are some objective facts about Australian manufacturing, in real dollar terms;

See ABS 5676.0 Tables 6, 9 and 17.

Until the GFC, manufacturing in Australia was growing (wages, sales, profits) since around March 2001, but as a greater trend, since March 1991 but overall was growing since June 1984 (earliest data point).

Sales declined moderately since then. Profits have gone up a small amount since 2013/2014, when business confidence was quite low. Profits suffered from 2008 to 2013.

Wages have only dipped by a small amount.

Competing with a very strong dollar – high commodity prices, sure, but also high government debt and very loose monetary policy. It’s tough out there.

Australian manufacturing sales, wages and profits, pre-GFC were growing strongly, particularly after 2001, so during the early phase of the mining boom. This was after most subsidies, tariffs and other protections were cut or abolished.

Government macroeconomic policy killed manufacturing. Now they have to deal with NABERS etc, inflated electricity costs and very high land taxes.

Barking Toad
Barking Toad
March 13, 2024 2:50 pm

They’re Arabs of Mycenaean Greek heritage, at least the ones in Gaza are. Palestinians are a mythological species.

If they want to call themselves that I have no objection. If they want to live miserably that’s their choice. Gaza could’ve been the MENA version of Singapore. They were given that chance and chose…poorly.

Darts Bruce. Lovely darts.

Dot
Dot
March 13, 2024 2:53 pm

That wasn’t your claim. Try to tell the full story the first go.

Thanks for the tip.

This is a long way from fractious minorities inciting violence in the streets.

You must think assimilation, rule of law (you know, no inciting violence, deporting non-citizen criminals after they have completed their sentences), no special migration or language programmes and no welfare for migrants is a progressive recipe for disaster then.

I don’t know much about Defence Procurement, but quite clearly, you know less.

Nice handwaving.

Arky
March 13, 2024 2:57 pm

Government macroeconomic policy killed manufacturing. Now they have to deal with NABERS etc, inflated electricity costs and very high land taxes.

..
Don’t act as if there wasn’t a concerted, decades long ideological battle against manufacturing, of which your “but 3D printing” was a small part of the shit sandwich. It was decades of “but service economy”. “But free trade”. “But competitive advantage”. “But unions”. “but high wage economy”. “But no one wants to work in a factory”. Basically “but anything except manufacturing”. Well, good luck when you eventually have to face those slave labour made North Korean artillery shells. You can console yourself that, ideologically speaking, you were right. So pure.

Mother Lode
Mother Lode
March 13, 2024 3:03 pm

There is no evidence that Trump actually made that statement (“do whatever the hell they want”), but that doesn’t stop Kelly.

He said something along the lines of if countries in NATO don’t pay their dues then the US would not help them if attacked. Just his blustery way of saying that NATO countries must also abide by their obligations, otherwise why should America.

I saw it neatly put somewhere or other:

Anti-Trumpers don’t take him seriously but they take him literally while his supporters don’t take him literally but they do take him seriously.

His supporters know he has his oratorical transports, but anti-Trumpers leap on every word as prescription of policy. Or, perhaps more of a problem for them, the clipped and tweaked version the MSM vomits up. Whoopi Goldberg is still ululating that Trump has said he is going to be a dictator and concluded that from day one he is going to lock up gays and political opponents.

And there is the above too, of course.

Bruce of Newcastle
Bruce of Newcastle
March 13, 2024 3:06 pm

No movie post this week as I’m still in NZ seeing family.

Kiwi movies? The Piano and The Quiet Earth come to mind. I suppose I should also mention Hunt for the Wilderpeople, although I haven’t seen it. Anything with Sam Neill in it is probably good.

shatterzzz
March 13, 2024 3:06 pm

Just watched THE ZONE OF INTEREST which follows the lifestyle of the Auschwitz commandant Rudol Hoss & his family living a carefree lifestyle in opulent luxury adjacent to the camp ..
Nothing untoward happens in the entire hour 45minutes you never see inside Auschwitz, itself, just hear the noise, gunfire and distance glimpse of a furnace chimney either flaming or smoking …..
Unless you know something about the reality of Auschwitz it really has no impact
It is a movie made for folk who can grasp the ways of life on either side of the “wall” ..
Quite disquieting & engrossing once you get into it ….. 7/10
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt7160372/?ref_=nv_sr_srsg_1_tt_7_nm_0_q_the%2520zone%2520of%2520interest

duncanm
duncanm
March 13, 2024 3:13 pm

WolfmanOz
Mar 13, 2024 2:41 PM

I look forward to this Wolfman..

Nolan’s Batman interpretation was a marvellous reboot, and Interstellar is one of my faves.

John H.
John H.
March 13, 2024 3:14 pm

shatterzzz
Mar 13, 2024 3:06 PM
Just watched THE ZONE OF INTEREST which follows the lifestyle of the Auschwitz commandant Rudol Hoss & his family living a carefree lifestyle in opulent luxury adjacent to the camp ..

I appreciated it as art. It seemed to be a visual version of the banality of evil.

thefrollickingmole
thefrollickingmole
March 13, 2024 3:15 pm

People like this excite chippy..

https://twitter.com/i/status/1767740080708608175

Someone mentioned our government being educated by this sub mong.

“Tax cuts are bad, tax more”!!!!

Says the failed Greek finance minister.

John H.
John H.
March 13, 2024 3:16 pm

Mother Lode
Mar 13, 2024 3:03 PM
There is no evidence that Trump actually made that statement (“do whatever the hell they want”), but that doesn’t stop Kelly.

He said something along the lines of if countries in NATO don’t pay their dues then the US would not help them if attacked. Just his blustery way of saying that NATO countries must also abide by their obligations, otherwise why should America.

I saw it neatly put somewhere or other:

Anti-Trumpers don’t take him seriously but they take him literally while his supporters don’t take him literally but they do take him seriously.

There are Trump statements that cannot be taken literally or seriously because they are incomprehensible gibberish. For example, water destroys magnets.

Dot
Dot
March 13, 2024 3:18 pm

“But free trade”. “But competitive advantage”. “But unions”. “but high wage economy”. “But no one wants to work in a factory”. Basically “but anything except manufacturing”. Well, good luck when you eventually have to face those slave labour made North Korean artillery shells. You can console yourself that, ideologically speaking, you were right. So pure.

Enough myth-making. Manufacturing did not decline until the GFC which saw the AUD rise off the back of idiotic fiscal stimulus.

We lost our ability to make overpriced shoes and GM Holden took a subsidy and ran off with the money to America.

In the meantime – all the way back to Menzies, the economy was opened up and from the mid-1980s to 2008, sales, wages and profits all grew, and grew rapidly after most subsidies were gone, and during the first part of the mining boom (2001 to 2008).

Don’t act as if there wasn’t a concerted, decades long ideological battle against manufacturing, of which your “but 3D printing” was a small part of the shit sandwich.

3D printing, which has made anyone with a laptop a manufacturer, is part of an anti-manufacturing conspiracy?

Dot
Dot
March 13, 2024 3:20 pm

“a potential* manufacturer” as everyone is nit-picky and has poop on the liver.

*Greatness?

duncanm
duncanm
March 13, 2024 3:22 pm

Bruce of Newcastle
Mar 13, 2024 3:06 PM
No movie post this week as I’m still in NZ seeing family.

Kiwi movies? The Piano and The Quiet Earth come to mind. I suppose I should also mention Hunt for the Wilderpeople, although I haven’t seen it. Anything with Sam Neill in it is probably good.

a few Hobbit epics and a good zombie sheep film, too.

Not a movie, but you can’t go past Seven periods with Mr Gormsby

Winston Smith
March 13, 2024 3:24 pm

https://open.substack.com/pub/harryrichardson/p/if-india-can-exclude-muslims-why?r=1easrn&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email
It looks like India has had a gutful of Islam and its inability to coexist with others.
If they can do it why can’t we?
Or will we accept them because we cannot stand to be called names?

thefrollickingmole
thefrollickingmole
March 13, 2024 3:24 pm

Elon bringing the harshness

Is his figures correct though?

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1767760340488528084

Mother Lode
Mother Lode
March 13, 2024 3:28 pm

For example, water destroys magnets.

Very odd. Where did he say that?

Eyrie
Eyrie
March 13, 2024 3:35 pm

Dot,
Do you own a 3D printer? Good for prototyping and low volume production. Parts generally need some post processing. As other have pointed out for high volume parts injection molding or die casting are usually used instead.
There may be a case for 3D printing in some complex shapes or for parts with complex load paths that can’t be efficiently made any other way. Typically this would be in aerospace where weight is important and volume is low.
By auto industry standards the entire aerospace industry volume including Boeing and Airbus etc are cottage industries.

Dot
Dot
March 13, 2024 3:37 pm

Water is weakly diamagnetic, but the permeability is about the same as air.

Dot
Dot
March 13, 2024 3:39 pm

“3D printing” no no. Additive manufacturing.

There’s a good case for metal sintering over cast metal.

JC
JC
March 13, 2024 3:41 pm

3D printing, which has made anyone with a laptop a manufacturer, is part of an anti-manufacturing conspiracy?

LOL

Zulu Kilo Two Alpha
Zulu Kilo Two Alpha
March 13, 2024 3:55 pm

WA delivers blunt message to Eastern States over carve-up of GST: ‘Suffer in your jocks’
Josh Zimmerman and Dan Jervis-BardyPerthNow
March 13, 2024 11:12AM
Comments
Topics
GST
Federal Politics
WA News

Treasurer Rita Saffioti has delivered one of her bluntest GST dismissals yet amid grumblings over the latest carve-up that penalised Queensland and NSW for their surging coal royalties.

WA received an $830 million boost to its slice of GST next year — taking the total to $7.25 billion — while Queensland and NSW are forecast to record cuts of $469m and $310m respectively.

But talking to The West Australian, Ms Saffioti had little sympathy for the two States.

“We’ve been facing it year in, year out, to a much bigger degree before the floor came in,” she said.

“No one sympathised with us. They said, ‘Oh, you’ve got royalties, good luck.’ Now they have the same situation.”

Responding to the outcome — which also resulted in Victoria’s estimated GST revenue soaring by $3.7 billion — Ms Saffioti said other States were now experiencing what had been commonplace in WA prior to the 2018 fix.

“Welcome to our world,” she said. “We’re seeing New South Wales and Queensland receive cuts in their GST contribution because they’ve had coal royalties.

“That’s what was happening to us, year in year out. And now they’re saying the GST system is flawed? As I said — welcome to our world.”

Earlier, NSW Treasurer Daniel Mookhey was scathing of the latest carve-up, which he said illustrated the existing GST methodology was “out of touch”.

“NSW takes most of the nation’s population growth but is being punished by having its GST cut,” he said.

“It is an absurd process in dire need of reform.

“I agree with former treasurer Perrottet, when he railed in 2018 against the ‘black magic GST distribution formula’ which was ‘seeing the hardworking taxpayers of NSW being ripped off by a perverse and unfair distribution model’.”

Ms Saffioti said she could empathise with her east coast counterparts and agreed there were issues with the GST formula because it created “massive volatility” and made it difficult to budget.

But she was short on sympathy.

“We’ve been facing it year in, year out to a much bigger degree before the floor came in,” she said.

“No one sympathised with us.”

The GST is distributed on the basis of “horizontal fiscal equalisation”, with States effectively handicapped for their ability to raise revenue from alternative sources — such as mining royalties or stamp duty.

However — as highlighted by Ms Saffioti on Monday — pokies taxes and toll road revenue, neither of which is collected in WA, are exempt from the formula.

Under the system in place prior to 2018, WA’s GST share would have fallen to 11¢ in the dollar next year, slashing the State’s share by $6.2 billion to just $1.05 billion.

Top Ender
Top Ender
March 13, 2024 3:57 pm

In Cloive News:

It’s not quite the Love Boat, but Clive Palmer still believes in the power of cruise ships to bring people together.

Or, at least in the power of Titanic II, which the Queensland billionaire — estimated net worth $23 billion, “give or take 10 or 15 per cent” — recommitted to building at an Opera House news conference Wednesday morning.

Palmer’s plans to build a modern version of the Titanic, which famously sank in 1912 with a loss of 1517 lives, have been announced and re-announced several times since the idea was first laid out in 2013.

Palmer said the ship would offer “a journey back in time” when it makes its first planned crossing sometime in 2027.

But, speaking to a pack of journalists who had moments before been treated to a promotional video set to the strains of The Blue Danube, Palmer said his new Titanic was not just about recreating the world of “Rose and Jack” that so many people know from the movie.

No, more than that, the project was about giving hope to a troubled planet.

“We hope that this vessel will be something that can bring the world together in a more positive outlook that we’re facing today.”

“And it brings all the countries of the countries of the world in a more positive outlook that we’re facing today, as well as a return to the values that we’ve stood for in the West, in particular.”

Ticking off conflicts in Ukraine and the Middle East and other potential flashpoints, Palmer sounded one part mystic, one part arch capitalist as he suggested that the unifying vision of Titanic II could bring people together.

“Making wars is pretty easy … but you know, making peace is a lot harder,” Palmer said.

In relaunching the project, which is estimated to cost around $1 billion and see the 269 metre long vessel built in European shipyards, Palmer also made no apologies for a ship that if it comes off will be as different as can be imagined to the party ships of Richard Branson.

The ship will be divided between first, second, and third class cabins, and if the promotional video is anything to go by it will be heavy on wood panelling and dressing for dinner.

The ship will be “a statement of values,” Palmer reiterated.

While this second Titanic will be built to the highest safety standards, Palmer said the original Titanic resonated in time because the story embodied “courage, resilience, service.”

“I think they’re the things we’re missing today … we remember the musicians who played Nearer My God To Thee as the ship sunk.”

“What was important for people was not saving themselves, but serving others.”

Steve trickler
Steve trickler
March 13, 2024 4:01 pm

120,000 quid he spent and now he’s caught in a pickle.

The battery replacement cost is horrendous.

—-

TheMacMaster”

my ELECTRIC CAR is now WORTHLESS EVen the DEALERSHIP doesn’t want it back! EVs are DISPOSABLE JUNK!!

Arky
March 13, 2024 4:01 pm

3D printing, which has made anyone with a laptop a manufacturer, is part of an anti-manufacturing conspiracy?

..
Not “3D printing”.
Your argument “but 3D printing”.
I It’s quite strange to conflate the argument “don’t worry about the demise of manufacturing, we can 3D print everything soon” with 3D manufacturing itself.
Are you attempting to make it seem as if I am opposed to 3D printing? That would be slightly dishonest.
Dot.
Please indicate that you understand the difference between being opposed to using 3D printing as an excuse and being opposed to 3D printing itself.

Johnny Rotten
Johnny Rotten
March 13, 2024 4:02 pm

PAX

COMMENT: I have investigated what you have said about our Western leaders. From the US to Britain, the Balkans, France, Poland, and Germany, they all want war. I am 77 now. My whole life was about creating peace. I remember Richard Nixon opening China and dividing it from Russia. I believe you are correct. There is no explanation for everyone seeking war other than to hide their appalling government mismanagement.

Thank you for your analysis.

GKB

REPLY: History repeats, and human nature never changes. We have the model from Rome, the greatest empire ever created. The Pax Romana was achieved by everyone benefiting in their economic relations. Once these people removed Russia from the SWIFT system, they condemned the United States to its demise. The rise of the BRICS has nothing to do with fiat money. All money has always been fiat. From ancient times, we find imitation coinage of the dominant economy being created by other regions, showing that there was always a premium over the metal content if it was a coin of the dominant economy like the US dollar today.”

https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/world-news/war/pax/?utm_source=Newsletter&utm_medium=Email&utm_campaign=RSS

Boambee John
Boambee John
March 13, 2024 4:05 pm

Dot

You must think assimilation, rule of law (you know, no inciting violence, deporting non-citizen criminals after they have completed their sentences), no special migration or language programmes and no welfare for migrants is a progressive recipe for disaster then.

No, all quite reasonable. However, I see little enthusiasm among our rulers to actually implement any of these. As a simple example, look at the numerous large scale “demonstrations” about Israel and Gaza. In which of them was there any enthusiasm to arrest inciters of violence? As for deportation after completion of sentences, I refer you to the recent High Court decision.

The reason? From what I see, no government is willing to take on a group that went rapidly from “Not enough to be a problem” to “Too many to control”.

So, Step 1, stop increasing the scale of the problem. At the moment, there is both a popular enthusiasm to reduce immigration drastically (housing shortages, per-capita recession) and a good reason for doing so (stop increasing the scale of the “culturally incompatible” problem).

Step 2, reduce the scale. My suggestion is to offer money to those who renounce their Australian citizenship or their residency visa, and agree in writing never to return to Australia. Add to that your robust approach to non-citizen criminals, and movement will occur.

Step3, once the numbers are again “Not enough to be a problem”, then go hard on assimilation, the equal rule of law and the other changes you suggest. But until the numbers of culturally incompatible residents are reduced, no government will even try for assimilation and the equal rule of law.

Arky
March 13, 2024 4:05 pm

So far, we have had:
“Don’t worry about the demise of manufacturing, everything will be 3D printed in the future”.
Then:
“Well, they aren’t 3D printing everything because they aren’t using it to its full potential, so I wasn’t wrong” or something.
Now, latest is:
“What do you mean manufacturing is gone? Covid or something”.
Wow.
Amazing.

Dot
Dot
March 13, 2024 4:06 pm

Please indicate that you understand the difference between being opposed to using 3D printing as an excuse and being opposed to 3D printing itself.

Don’t act as if there wasn’t a concerted, decades long ideological battle against manufacturing, of which your “but 3D printing” was a small part of the shit sandwich.

Even though I mentioned additive manufacturing all along, like metal sintering.

Okay, pal.

The sundowning has commenced.

There’s no “excuse”, because what did Australian manufacturing in was the GFC and our fiscal policy, not trade policy prior. I’ve shown you the data from the ABS, now, accept reality.

It doesn’t matter if the share of GDP of an industry goes down. Agriculture is what, 3% of the economy? It still makes up significant export volumes. No one is claiming we’re running out of food and if we had autarky we’d have a food surplus.

JC
JC
March 13, 2024 4:07 pm

Wow. I only look at the iron ore price about once or twice a week. It’s taken a shellacking. Since mid Feb it’s down 20% ($130.11). It was $116 7th March and now $104.60.

This is very ungood.

Arky
March 13, 2024 4:11 pm

Okay, pal.

..
I’m not your pal.
I like talking with you online at times, but we are not friends, nor have I today used any nicknames or insults when referring to you.
If you wish to continue, don’t use that stupid crap on me.

caveman
caveman
March 13, 2024 4:12 pm

Musk probably going to make a nylon shelled car with the amount of sand (glass beads) hes talking about.

Eyrie
Eyrie
March 13, 2024 4:12 pm

There’s a good case for metal sintering over cast metal.

Depends what you are making. 3D printing/sintering is no manufacturing panacea.
Some years ago some folks in Texas 3D printed a M1911A1. When I read the article it had had more than 5000 rounds through it and still going strong. I’m not sure this is a standard gun manufacturing thing though.
BTW, a laptop can drive a CNC manufacturing cell too. These are quite good with high speed drives and relatively low pressures required unlike more traditional ones.

JC
JC
March 13, 2024 4:15 pm

Juan

You have plenty of time. Set up a large scale manufacturing plant and then thumb your nose at us, after showing the plebs how it’s done. You keep reminding us of your gut raw intelligence. Become the New Zealand Musk. If there’s anyone who can do it, it’s obviously you.

There’s plenty of money available to fund a good idea too. There are lots of private equity firms busting to fund can-do entrepreneurs liker yourself.

Arky
March 13, 2024 4:16 pm

There’s no “excuse”, because what did Australian manufacturing in was the GFC and our fiscal policy, not trade policy prior.

..
I have not argued trade or fiscal policies with you at any point today.
The point I made today was solely this:
You said ten years ago that my concerns about the loss of manufacturing were not valid due, in part, to the likelihood that 3D printing would replace much of it.
Ten years down the track, that has NOT happened.
That, and that alone is the point you need to address if you are responding to me. Of course you are free to go off on any other trajectory you like, but that doesn’t require a response from me.

Dot
Dot
March 13, 2024 4:18 pm

Once these people removed Russia from the SWIFT system, they condemned the United States to its demise. The rise of the BRICS has nothing to do with fiat money. All money has always been fiat.

Hello ChatGPT.

Pure horseshit.

Winston Smith
March 13, 2024 4:28 pm

My Aunty Win just passed away at the age of 103, after a short illness. She’d had several TIA’s, and finally stroked out this AM. She’d been looked after at home – there are about five nurses in the family and Win always had someone at her side during the night.

(Another hundred words deleted because this isn’t the time or place for it.)

JC
JC
March 13, 2024 4:31 pm

Juan

You’ve been pushing this empty cart for well over a decade now, and it’s getting stale. In your usual dishonest ways, you made it sound earlier that people here have advocated for expensive energy, labor market constipation, union meddling, and unfriendly government policy towards manufacturing when the opposite is the case. The arguments against that crap have been posted here almost every single day.

What you’ve been advocating for in the past but are silent about now is a wall of tariffs and massive subsidies. I’d call that nostalgianomics—a hankering for the past when we did have those policies, and it almost killed the country.

You’re basically arguing for peronism, which ironically is currently being dismantled piece by piece in Argentina.

Also, you pay little regard to the other parts of this industrial economy that have an outsized, very high tech mining industry and agricultural sector, which are the envy of the world.

Seeing as we have very low unemployment, you’d rather move people from very profitable sectors to less profitable ones, which would do wonders for living standards.

Dot
Dot
March 13, 2024 4:45 pm

You said ten years ago that my concerns about the loss of manufacturing were not valid due, in part, to the likelihood that 3D printing would replace much of it.

They were never valid and here is an example of where 3D printing is used.

Australian manufacturing has a trend that you wouldn’t know unless you looked at the data.

Take 5368.0 Table 5 (Table 4. Goods debits (exports), original, current prices.

Compare the sum of machinery, transport equipment and other manufactures to total non-rural goods.

In 1971, it made up 0.16% of non-rural goods exports.

Now, it makes up 10.04% of non-rural goods exports

These industries are elaborately transformed manufactures and are using additive technology, to varying degrees.

The GFC and COVID knocked these industries, but they’re growing despite trade policy. They grew at high rates during 2017 – 2020. Their export growth was 8.6% p.a. CAGR from March 2017 to March 2020.

The growth of “machinery” and “other manufactures” have grown in excess of the decline of “transport equipment” and “other manufactures” has grown significantly since 2001 over the other two categories in terms of constant dollar value.

So on the empirical evidence, it appears as though my analysis, twisted as much as it was by some readers, was correct.

John H.
John H.
March 13, 2024 4:45 pm

Mother Lode
Mar 13, 2024 3:28 PM
For example, water destroys magnets.

Very odd. Where did he say that?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rkIKEJPAUzM

Arky
Arky
March 13, 2024 4:52 pm

Dot
Mar 13, 2024 4:45 PM
You said ten years ago that my concerns about the loss of manufacturing were not valid due, in part, to the likelihood that 3D printing would replace much of it.

They were never valid and here is an example of where 3D printing is used.

..
That isn’t what I asked.
Nor did I claim there are no examples of 3D manufacturing.
Focus Dot. Focus.
The subject is whether or not 3D printing has, as I believe you claimed, or very heavily implied, replaced all the manufacturing processes required in a functioning industrial base.
Your inability to acknowledge this to be true, when it so obviously is, is now becoming comic.
Why can’t you just say “Yep, I over estimated the impact of 3D printing, but… “and then whatever further points you wish to make.
Your inability to do this in the context of berating Winston, is the topic.
Not fiscal policy, not GDP or the future of agriculture.

Bruce of Newcastle
Bruce of Newcastle
March 13, 2024 4:53 pm

The situation looks exceedingly bleak for Ukraine

ROFLMAO.

The Russians exploited a few km after Avdiivka then bled out. But they got the victory that the Kremlin required.

We’ll see what happens after the election.

Arky
March 13, 2024 4:54 pm

And we can get to EM- drive after you have dealt with your misunderstanding of the potential of 3D manufacturing to replace existing refined and robust processes.

JC
JC
March 13, 2024 5:05 pm

Arky
Mar 13, 2024 4:54 PM

And we can get to EM- drive

And we get tariff walls and subsidies that will somehow cure all. You appear to forget those little foibles. Now you’re blaming people here as though they’ve advocated for those points I mentioned above.

The fact is that even if 3D isn’t a prime driver of innovation that was cracked to be (I believe it still is), the way ahead in making somefink will require even far less people than it does now. It’s been that way since the Industrial Revolution, no matter what anyone says, least of all you.

GreyRanga
GreyRanga
March 13, 2024 5:08 pm

Another movie by Jane Campion is about a NZ author Janet Frame. I’ve just ordered it for my wife who likes her writing. An Angel at my Table. Frame suffered mental illness and wrote about it in fictionalised stories.

Bruce of Newcastle
Bruce of Newcastle
March 13, 2024 5:09 pm

Bruce, I guess your sources are better than the French military.

Cheese eating surrender monkeys. I fart in their general direction.

I’m not saying anything that isn’t bleeding obvious.

Black Ball
Black Ball
March 13, 2024 5:10 pm

Andrew Bolt:

What should frighten even Labor supporters is that Andrew Giles – in trouble yet again – isn’t even the biggest underperformer in the Albanese Government.

The question now is: Is this Government even worse than Gough Whitlam’s?

Is it not only dangerously ideological, but incompetent?

Giles might seem Exhibit A after his latest embarrassment.

He’s admitted the 149 foreign criminals he freed from detention last year – including murderers and 37 sex offenders – were given invalid visas.

That means at least 10 will escape prosecution for breaching their now-invalid visa conditions, like breaking curfews or not reporting to police.

Giles’ performance makes me ask how many mistakes a minister in this Government can make before Prime Minister Anthony Albanese finally sacks them.

Count ‘em.

Last year the High Court ruled Giles had to free a Burmese pedophile from immigration detention, since there was no real chance he could be sent back home.

Giles was caught unprepared, even though one judge warned months earlier this ruling was probably coming.

Result: he released the pedophile – plus 148 other criminals he thought were in the same position – without any initial plan to keep an eye on them and control their movement, and no laws to get them put away if they proved to be a danger.

Worse, it turned out he’d skipped two meetings in his own office to discuss what to do if the High Court ruled as it did, going instead to events to promote Labor’s doomed Voice, its planned Aboriginal-only advisory parliament.

But it’s not just that. With Giles as Immigration Minister, this government:

• Let in a record 520,000 immigrants, net, in just one year, helping to cause a housing shortage;

• Gave visas to 2000 Palestinians in terrorist-run Gaza and the West Bank during this war, with cursory checks in as little as a day;

• Gave people smugglers hope just four days after it was elected by letting a Biloela family of fake refugees from Sri Lanka stay, and later rewarding another 19,000 illegal boat people with permanent visas;

• Let two boats of illegal immigrants land on our coast; and

• Let 81 councils ban citizenship ceremonies on Australia Day, further weakening our unity.

That’s some record in less than two years, yet Giles is far from the worst or most damaging of the ministers of a government struggling to perform basic tasks.

Take Chris Bowen, the Climate Change and Energy Minister.

What’s he touched that hasn’t then gone to custard?

Bowen is on a crusade to pretend to save us from a pretend “climate crisis” by replacing our coal-fired power stations with wind and solar. That means as much as 90 per cent of our base-load power will be gone in a decade, to be replaced by … er, what?

Bowen’s rollout of wind and solar plants is way behind, as is his scheme for 28,000km of transmission lines to hook them all up. His Snowy 2.0 scheme to store green power is already 10 times the promised price.

Now his plan to make Australians buy more electric cars – 89 per cent of new car sales by 2030 – is attacked as impossible by car companies and a “ute tax” by the Opposition.

It’s a mess. The Australian Energy Market Operator warns of more blackouts from next summer and Bowen’s promise to cut electricity bills by $275 by next year is laughable.

Yet Bowen, too, is still a minister – and still not the Government’s most inept minister. The most dangerous, but not most incompetent.

That’s probably Linda Burney, the Indigenous Australians Minister.

She didn’t just oversee Labor’s catastrophic campaign for the Voice, which was rejected last year by 60 per cent of voters, with Burney incapable of explaining why we needed it.

What else has she done, as crime by Aboriginal youths in towns like Alice Springs explodes? What – apart from this week giving us a $4 billion plan to build houses at an astonishing $1.4 million a pop for just 10,000 Aborigines, and build them in remote areas, exactly where there are no good jobs?

Need I go on?

This is a Government that is keeping us out of recession only by ramping up immigration and getting lucky on windfall prices for resources like the fossil fuels it hates.

It’s meanwhile hammered business with pro-union restrictions that will keep productivity increases at lows it admits we haven’t seen in 60 years. No wonder Australians last year got 1 per cent poorer, on average, per person.

What’s this Government good for? Worse than Whitlam.

Bowen is a dangerous idiot but I think the worst is Tony Burke, alongside the Wong Chap. Proud to see Palestinian flags atop public buildings, no backing of Israel, silence on the rallies calling for the elimination of Israel. Just a disgraceful effort.

Bungonia Bee
Bungonia Bee
March 13, 2024 5:14 pm

Chris Kenny does some good work on examining the way the ABC’s Ferguson kneecaps the coalition’s energy spokesman. It’s why we don’t bother watching the national broadcaster any more. But we have to keep paying for the collective.

Indolent
Indolent
March 13, 2024 5:34 pm

Something I came across today. Still think it’s too generous.

Bon mot
90% of politicians give the rest a bad name.
Henry Kissinger

Dot
Dot
March 13, 2024 5:35 pm

The subject is whether or not 3D printing has, as I believe you claimed, or very heavily implied, replaced all the manufacturing processes required in a functioning industrial base.

This is a construction of your imagination, like Australian manufacturing suffering any non-temporary output loss before the GFC.

I’ve just shown you how an industry sub-sector that uses additive manufacturing has made up for any losses in exports that PMVs ever made as export sales.

Our industrial base means nothing to a true global conflict. We’d be nuked.

We gave GM Holden 270 million AUD and they ran away with it.

The only thing that wrecked Australia’s industrial base was a high AUD.

See ABS 5625.0 Table 4.

The summary of capital expenditure (flow data) for machinery in Australian manufacturing since June 1987 is growth until late 2005 (a local maximum), a decline until early 2016 then rapid growth until now (now exceeding 2005 figures).

The cumulative sum of this figure (capital stock, gross fixed capital formation of manufacturing machinery) for this period has grown from 1378 mn to 268817 mn, net of depreciation, growing at 15% per annum.

The capital stock for the machinery required for manufacturing has grown nearly linearly (net of depreciation), the flows have never fell below the initial flow value and the rate of capital investment has increased as additive technologies have come into existence.

Our industrial base has grown and the recent, rapid growth was from additive technology in ETM exported goods.

Knuckle Dragger
Knuckle Dragger
March 13, 2024 5:41 pm

Finally.

An economics-based stoush.

Bruce of Newcastle
Bruce of Newcastle
March 13, 2024 5:41 pm

Well, sure, French military on the ground in Ukraine are cowards and less informed than us on the east ceast of Oz. This is obvious.

Maybe you should look up what the Frenchies in the trenches in WW1 thought of their general officer class. Little change since.

The facts on the ground are that nothing much is happening. That’s because defense has quite the upper hand in the current force mix – very like WW1. The Russians committed the necessary military assets to assault the Avdiivka salient and succeeded…at a very painful cost. That achieved the necessary political aims before the election.

As a result of that effort the Russian Army is rather stuffed at the moment, and has to get its breath back. And a lot of replacements. They burned all their ready offensive forces in one all out attack. And succeeded. But without something new they aren’t in any position to do much. Which is why I’m very interested in what gets announced after the election.

Arky
March 13, 2024 5:42 pm

Dot
Mar 13, 2024 5:35 PM

This is a construction of your imagination

..
Are you now claiming you didn’t spend a considerable amount of both my and your time and energy trying to convince me that you’d be downloading and 3D printing a car at some point?
That when I pointed out that cars have bits that aren’t amenable to such that you tried to provide numerous arguments that they were?
Wow.
Amazing.
One of us has a really, really bad memory.
Did you take the jabs?

John H.
John H.
March 13, 2024 5:44 pm

dover0beach
Mar 13, 2024 5:26 PM
Cheese eating surrender monkeys. I fart in their general direction.

I’m not saying anything that isn’t bleeding obvious.

Well, sure, French military on the ground in Ukraine are cowards and less informed than us on the east coast of Oz. This is obvious.

Do you want Russia to conquer Ukraine?

We don’t know how well informed the French military is about Ukraine.
We don’t the motivation for the article. It might be a polemic to promote greater involvement. Macron’s recent statements reflect that idea.

This is obviously wrong because Ukrainian drones have struck deep inside Russia.

Add to this the “Russian super-dominance in the field of electronic jamming penalizing, on the Ukrainian side, the use of drones and command systems”.

Ukraine is on its knees yet one month later Russia has not moved? If the enemy keep going.

On February 17, Kiev had to abandon the city of Avdiivka, in the northern suburbs of Donetsk, which had until then been a fortified stronghold. “It was both the heart and symbol of Ukrainian resistance in the Russian-speaking Donbass,”

Dot
Dot
March 13, 2024 5:50 pm

Are you now claiming you didn’t spend a considerable amount of both my and your time and energy trying to convince me that you’d be downloading and 3D printing a car at some point?

Oh come off it, you really are being a git now with this hyperbolic nonsense.

Black Ball
Black Ball
March 13, 2024 5:56 pm

Deary me. Daily Telegraph:

The NSW Young Liberals are facing accusations they’ve gone “woke” after disinviting a controversial commentator and men’s rights advocate from a university event about the Brittany Higgins case.

Writer and social commentator Bettina Arndt was due to appear on a panel next week for the University of Sydney’s Conservative Club, discussing the Higgins saga and the ensuing legal, political and media firestorm alongside media colleagues Chris Merritt, legal commentator for The Australian, and author Andrew Urban.

The line-up for the ‘Lawfare in Australia’ event has been promoted internally by the club since early February, however just seven days before the talk was due to take place, Arndt was abruptly informed by an organiser that she was now “not permitted” to take the stage.

An online listing currently brands the event as “a critical examination of Australia’s legal system and it’s (sic) weaponisation”, with no mention of the Higgins case.

Sources said the rescinded invitation came at the instruction of NSW Young Liberals president Chanum Torres, who had urged the Conservative Club to abandon the event entirely, and allegedly warned organisers their future careers could be at risk if they pursued Arndt as a panellist.

The ‘cancellation’ comes in sharp contrast to the club’s support for Arndt in 2018, when they hosted the commentator’s talk declaring the “rape crisis” on university campuses is “fake” while facing a protest so extreme riot police were called in. Torres became president of the uni’s Conservative Club that month.

The club’s website states they “are not aligned with any political party” and “as such, we are independent in developing and advocating Conservative ideas”.

Arndt said Torres and the Young Liberals have “cower(ed) in fear” from activists, making the party’s future leadership look “very bleak”.

“This is the same club who once had the courage to stare down the feral feminists who attacked them for weeks before the event,” Arndt said.

“Once again the Conservative Club was willing to be courageous and include me in the event but it is the Young Liberals who have caved in to the woke.”

Fellow panellist Andrew Urban said he was “very disappointed” by the club’s decision to remove Ms Arndt from the line-up, and questioned the organisation’s commitment to its values of freedom of speech and debate.

“I think it’s a very indefensible decision … and it doesn’t make any sense for a liberal organisation,” he said.

Torres was contacted for comment but did not respond. The Conservative Club did not respond to questions or a request for comment.

If these are future Liberal Party members of parliament, then Lord have mercy.

Indolent
Indolent
March 13, 2024 6:05 pm
Bungonia Bee
Bungonia Bee
March 13, 2024 6:06 pm

Don’t worry. The ABC will make sure that governments give us affordable and reliable power.

Arky
March 13, 2024 6:09 pm

Dot Avatar
Dot
Mar 13, 2024 5:50 PM
Are you now claiming you didn’t spend a considerable amount of both my and your time and energy trying to convince me that you’d be downloading and 3D printing a car at some point?

Oh come off it, you really are being a git now with this hyperbolic nonsense.

..
Again, at no time have I insulted you.
I am merely asking you to admit you got something wrong, that you did indeed get wrong.
We can get into the EM-drive stuff later, or GDP or anything else you like. But there isn’t any point if you are unable to concede to a mistake from long ago that few will hold against you on here.
Are you capable of that?
The denial or avoidance is far worse (for you, not for me, I don’t care if you keep your misunderstandings) than the initial mistake or lack of understanding of how things are manufactured.

Arky
March 13, 2024 6:11 pm

Actually Dot, I have a genuine GDP question for you, if you can calm down a bit and are up for it.

Bruce of Newcastle
Bruce of Newcastle
March 13, 2024 6:11 pm

What I said about Armatas and industrial priorities upthread, the Russians aren’t dumb. They’ve been learning the lessons of this war.

Russia Producing 3 Times More Shells Than US, Europe Combined: NATO Report (13 Mar)

Add in the munitions they’re buying from the Norks. The value of artillery will continue until laser defense systems are good enough to intercept the shells. That seems some number of years in the future, although rapid advances are being made in the space.

Tom
Tom
March 13, 2024 6:13 pm

ABC 7.30 host Sarah Ferguson is a poorly educated loumouth smartarse knowall who’s never had a real job.

The loony Green minority she represents is at war not only with aspirational Australia, but with the free market that has delivered our national wealth.

Shut. It. Down. Fire. Them. All.

GreyRanga
GreyRanga
March 13, 2024 6:15 pm

Why am I reminded of the only thing President Ohomo got right. “Never underestimate Joe’s ( Labor) ability to stuff things up”.

Rosie
Rosie
March 13, 2024 6:16 pm

Where is the evidence that modern day Palestinians are descendants of the Philistines?
The articles I’m finding say the Philistines intermarried with locals before becoming extinct around 600BC.
Being descendants of the Philistines would bolster Palestinian claims, not undermine them.

Rosie
Rosie
March 13, 2024 6:16 pm
Rosie
Rosie
March 13, 2024 6:17 pm

The takeaway is that the Torah does tell us a lot about the history of the Jews.

H B Bear
H B Bear
March 13, 2024 6:18 pm

ABC 7.30 host Sarah Ferguson is a poorly educated loumouth smartarse knowall who’s never had a real job.

Mrs Snowcone. QED

Mother Lode
Mother Lode
March 13, 2024 6:21 pm

Thanks, John H.

That it is a short clip – two sentences – as presented by Stephen Colbert. Like I said before. No context. Kind of the point I was making.

You may well ask “But it is not true. It is not true in any context”. We only get from the clip is Trump saying “All I know about magnets is…give me a glass of water, let me drop in the magnets, that’s the end of the magnets”. I would also note that the banner used in the clip is “Trump Rants About Magnets”. Not really a rant. More a throw away.

Maybe he was talking about the magnetic field, maybe he was talking about the material of magnets. Maybe he was talking about a proposed application of magnets. Maybe he was re-telling a story he had been told.

Or, quite possibly, it is something about which he has over the years picked up and misremembered since he had had no cause to remember it. I think there will be all sorts of sciencey things lay people believe which is wrong.

But there are his extempore speeches (and he is almost unique in his gift for those) and there are policy decisions. I do not think Trump would turn down an idea on an important matter because he was too pigheaded to change his mind about magnets.

Alas all these speculations are moot because, as I mentioned in my original post, the MSM (and Salon, and Stephen Colbert) give carefully edited takes. They thought it important we not see any more even though surely he would have made a bigger ass of himself with more context, right?

miltonf
miltonf
March 13, 2024 6:24 pm

Yes we really have a gubmint of marxist haters and wreckers. Some of them very posh marxist haters and wreckers- ejucated at some of the snottiest snotty nosed skools imaginable. That Giles really is a PoS.

Tom
Tom
March 13, 2024 6:24 pm

Prime minister Anthony Albanese represents the Labor left faction. The Wong Chap is in the Labor left faction. So is the incompetent immigration minister Andrew Giles.

None of them will lose their jobs because, for the first time in decades, the Labor left runs the federal government, so it doesn’t matter whether you’re incompetent, but which leftwing tribe you belong to — backed by violent street mob enforcers.

Bruce of Newcastle
Bruce of Newcastle
March 13, 2024 6:24 pm

The articles I’m finding say the Philistines intermarried with locals before becoming extinct around 600BC.

If they intermarried with the locals they didn’t become extinct. DNA evidence tracks that.

Doesn’t bolster the claims of the Palis since the Sea Peoples arrived long after Abraham. The Israelis are the owners by right of God’s gift and also by right of conquest. In any case the Mycenaeans seem to’ve kept to the coastal zone after they arrived. Israel never conquered Gaza, not even in David’s time.

Shows what one modest volcano in the Aegean can do to world history. The aftermath is still playing out more than three millennia later.

Indolent
Indolent
March 13, 2024 6:28 pm
miltonf
miltonf
March 13, 2024 6:31 pm

As much as I loathe Hawke, he was correct in calling the labor left a canker.

H B Bear
H B Bear
March 13, 2024 6:32 pm

The Liar Left also gave us Gillard. They don’t really value competence. Hawke/Keating it ain’t.

miltonf
miltonf
March 13, 2024 6:35 pm

And another thing, Abbott should just stfu.

Rosie
Rosie
March 13, 2024 6:35 pm

If you don’t think arriving in 3600BC bolsters Palestinian claims, okay.
The Philistines have nothing to do with Palestinians even though the Palestinians claim they are descendants.
The reality is a bunch of people immigrated into the Levant from Southern Europe were genetically distinct for a brief period of time then their DNA record disappeared.
It tells us nothing about modern Palestinians.

Rosie
Rosie
March 13, 2024 6:36 pm
duncanm
duncanm
March 13, 2024 6:36 pm

Dot
Mar 13, 2024 4:06 PM

Even though I mentioned additive manufacturing all along, like metal sintering.

Dot – either you’re talking through your arse, or you’re just being loose with language.

Sintering is a process which was around way before 3D printing.

Some 3D printing technologies use it – either direct laser sintering, or wet adhesive-style with subsequent cleaning then (sinter) fusing in an oven – but sintering itself is not a 3D thing.

miltonf
miltonf
March 13, 2024 6:38 pm

Trump really made Abbott and Howard out themselves as Bush globalists or something like that.

Rosie
Rosie
March 13, 2024 6:38 pm
Tom
Tom
March 13, 2024 6:42 pm

Why isn’t Greg Sheridan a figure of fun yet? He’s the quintessential never-Trump bowtie conservative and a major reason why Australian media coverage of American politics is so poor.

miltonf
miltonf
March 13, 2024 6:42 pm

FMD Don Harwin is the new president of the lieboral pardy in NSW.

Bungonia Bee
Bungonia Bee
March 13, 2024 6:45 pm

The loony Green minority she represents is at war not only with aspirational Australia, but with the free market that has delivered our national wealth.
It’s amazing it needs to be said. But there it is, there is our future.
Not a pretty sight.

miltonf
miltonf
March 13, 2024 6:46 pm

As you say Tom, the meja here carry on as if the internet doesn’t exist.

Bruce of Newcastle
Bruce of Newcastle
March 13, 2024 6:46 pm

If you don’t think arriving in 3600BC bolsters Palestinian claims, okay.

Rosie – The Israelis arrived in about 2,200 BC vs the Palis in about 1,500 BC. They can dispute who owns what as far as I am concerned. So far the Israelis are having the better of it.

The Philistines have nothing to do with Palestinians even though the Palestinians claim they are descendants.

Actually no the Palis claim they are descendants of the Canaanites. Which is slightly better than being Philistines. They still lost to the Israelites and therefore by right of conquest have no claim on the territory.

The DNA record has not disappeared, it is there and is being recorded. Whether DNA really matters is a different question entirely, but the available data supports the Israelis over the Palis in a vast number of areas. They should get over it and find a new occupation, since hating Jews isn’t especially productive.

Rosie
Rosie
March 13, 2024 6:47 pm

Palestinians are most likely descendants of Jews who converted to Christianity who intermarried with Arab Muslims and mostly converted, when they conquered Israel, along with 19th and early 20th century immigrants from Syria Lebanon Bosnia etc.
logical

Bungonia Bee
Bungonia Bee
March 13, 2024 6:51 pm

And: why are we weakly accepting the “daylight saving” regime that says “like it or not, you have to put up with your time being warped for six months of the year.”
I’m here to tell you that it’s a useless manipulation in a country that has more sunlight than it knows what to do with.
But I’ll do a deal: just reduce it to four months instead of the jackbooted six.
Start a month later and end a month earlier.

miltonf
miltonf
March 13, 2024 6:53 pm

Daylight saving’s never worried me. Just do everything an hour earlier.

duncanm
duncanm
March 13, 2024 6:54 pm

Nice little bit of analysis of natural numbers which suggest very strongly that Hamas death counts are complete fiction..

https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/how-gaza-health-ministry-fakes-casualty-numbers

Bruce of Newcastle
Bruce of Newcastle
March 13, 2024 6:55 pm

Um, yes, I’ll believe lefties any day of the week.

The DNA is an objective datum. The Bible is another objective datum. The Palis can go and visually investigate their own rectums. They deserve nothing. Maybe in a century or so they can earn a right to a hearing. Not now. They had their chance. Israel gave them Gaza to operate and instead of turning it into a western Singapore they used that gift as a way to kill Jews. They really are despicable arseholes.

Rosie
Rosie
March 13, 2024 6:57 pm

You claimed that the Palestinians were descendants of the Philistines then when it was pointed out that Philistinian DNA had disappeared from the record and there was no evidence they were descendants went off on a tangent.
The only relevant issue is that Israel had a right to exist and that the Jews have a valid claim.
I’m not discounting a valid claim by Gazans to living in Gaza.
Perhaps the best thing would be for them to revert to Judaism.

Zulu Kilo Two Alpha
Zulu Kilo Two Alpha
March 13, 2024 6:57 pm

Daylight saving’s never worried me. Just do everything an hour earlier.

Western Australia trialed “daylight saving” three times, and rejected it at referendum four times – when it’s 8.30 P.M., and the thermometer on the back verandah is reading 40 degrees, the last thing you need is more daylight…

Bruce of Newcastle
Bruce of Newcastle
March 13, 2024 7:01 pm

Rosie – Anyone who defends the Palestinians in any way at all is on the same level as people defending the SS at Auschwitz.

Bruce of Newcastle
Bruce of Newcastle
March 13, 2024 7:04 pm

Rosie – I will correct myself to mean muslim Palestinians, since the very few christian Palestinians are exceptionally brave people. Yes, the best thing the Palestinian people could do would be to convert…to Christianity. A Christian Gaza would be a very different place than the hellhole it presently is, and was before 7/10, I’m sure you will agree.

Salvatore, Iron Publican
March 13, 2024 7:05 pm

Daylight saving’s never worried me. Just do everything an hour earlier.

My ‘lations in Sydney hate daylight saving, as they go surfing of a morning before work & would rather spend another hour surfing.

I happened to be in Brisbane in the lead up to the most recent Qld referendum on daylight saving (during a “trial period” which lasted a couple of years)

Staying at digs in an inner city suburb full of professionals – real epicentre of the pro-daylight savings movement.
Went for a stroll each evening during that final hour of daylight – the hour “captured” by daylight saving.

Saw a total of One (1) person outdoors enjoying the sunshine, over the course of a week.
Where was everybody else? All those who march in the street for daylight saving?
They were inside, watching Prime Time TV.

Bruce of Newcastle
Bruce of Newcastle
March 13, 2024 7:08 pm

The Brits also claimed their officer class was incompetent.

Um yes, yes they were. Until Monash. Who wasn’t a Pom.

Of course Monash learned from Brusilov…who was a Russian. The Russians today could learn quite a lot from Brusilov’s tactics, but that requires a lot of careful preparation, training and discipline that the current Russian Army does not appear to have available.

GreyRanga
GreyRanga
March 13, 2024 7:12 pm

I freely accept that I am responsible for any mistakes I have made in the past. I have a wife to remind me, so I don’t need any keyboard wives to add to the humiliation of being wrong about everything even when I’m right coz that is even worse.

Bruce of Newcastle
Bruce of Newcastle
March 13, 2024 7:15 pm

I admire Gen. Brusilov a great deal. He almost won WW1 for Russia in 1916. It was a close run thing. Global history would’ve then been very different, and I suspect a lot better if he’d succeeded. No Russian Revolution, no Nazis. Probably no Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

MatrixTransform
March 13, 2024 7:18 pm

Congrats on knowing how to use Excel

dear oh dear

mUnty doesn’t get NPV

… or goalposts, it seems

Arky
March 13, 2024 7:19 pm

GreyRanga Avatar
GreyRanga
Mar 13, 2024 7:12 PM
I freely accept that I am responsible for any mistakes I have made in the past. I have a wife to remind me, so I don’t need any keyboard wives to add to the humiliation of being wrong about everything even when I’m right coz that is even worse

..
Agree.
Until someone starts to berate another about their “mistakes”.
Then it opens the question, eh?

Arky
March 13, 2024 7:22 pm

Especially if you start yapping about “accountability”.

miltonf
miltonf
March 13, 2024 7:22 pm

A Despicable Speech By A Despicable President

miltonf
miltonf
March 13, 2024 7:25 pm

Roger
Roger
March 13, 2024 7:41 pm

Net Zero FALLACY: Labour’s 2030 decarbonisation plans ‘a FANTASY’ – Jacob Rees-Mogg

Hear! Hear!

The Tory policy of net zero by 2050, otoh, is eminently sensible.

[sarc]

Rabz
March 13, 2024 7:43 pm

Why isn’t Greg Sheridan a figure of fun yet?

He’s certainly considered a joke by most commenters here. There are few more tiresome experiences than listening to Blot and Sheridini on Sky in the evenings. Rolled gold mediocrity.

Roger
Roger
March 13, 2024 7:44 pm

There are few more tiresome experiences than listening to Blot and Sheridini on Sky in the evenings. Rolled gold mediocrity.

They make for a good soporific, though.

Davey Boy
March 13, 2024 7:47 pm

For aficionados of rail:
https://inlandrail.artc.com.au/

“Inland Rail is a fast freight backbone that will transform how goods are moved around Australia, generating opportunities for our regions and our economy, now and well into the future.”

Inland Rail is offering the public a chance to take a survey to let them know how their message is getting across.

Survey:
https://url.au.m.mimecastprotect.com/s/cO3ICZYMMPcxlXBGFjGnow

(because we haven’t had a trucks vs trains stoush on this site for a while)

miltonf
miltonf
March 13, 2024 7:50 pm

Thanks Davey Boy.

miltonf
miltonf
March 13, 2024 7:52 pm

So Toowoomba might finally get a decent rail connection to Brissie.

Zulu Kilo Two Alpha
Zulu Kilo Two Alpha
March 13, 2024 7:53 pm

Um yes, yes they were. Until Monash. Who wasn’t a Pom.

The Canadians consider the greatest General from the Dominions one Arthur Currie – like Monash, a militiaman, not a regular.

Wally Dalí
Wally Dalí
March 13, 2024 7:55 pm

OMG Private Schoolboy stabs bloke in a carpark.
I can’t even. Four Corners warned me of this. Such a damning example of awful Christian violent and entitled toxic masculinity that graduated from the PRIVATE SCHOOL SYSTEM…
(checks notes)
…five years ago.
Probably not drugs and/or bumming at all.

Zulu Kilo Two Alpha
Zulu Kilo Two Alpha
March 13, 2024 7:57 pm

Saw a total of One (1) person outdoors enjoying the sunshine, over the course of a week.
Where was everybody else? All those who march in the street for daylight saving?
They were inside, watching Prime Time TV.

The last trial of daylight saving in the Wild West lasted three years. Each year, the evening news would depict all the happy families at the beach…for the first week….after that, they ran footage of the almost deserted beaches..

Boambee John
Boambee John
March 13, 2024 8:00 pm

dover0beach
Mar 13, 2024 7:03 PM

Maybe you should look up what the Frenchies in the trenches in WW1 thought of their general officer class. Little change since.

The Brits also claimed their officer class was incompetent. Still, I’m not sure what any of this has to do with these reports from the front. The rest is just a repeat of what you’ve said before.

And yet, it was the Germans who crossed No Man’s Land under a white flag, not the British and French.

Bruce of Newcastle
Bruce of Newcastle
March 13, 2024 8:01 pm

The Canadians consider the greatest General from the Dominions one Arthur Currie – like Monash, a militiaman, not a regular.

Memorialized in Starship Troopers.

I’ve not looked into Gen. Currie’s story. Something that I should do.

mareeS
mareeS
March 13, 2024 8:05 pm

JC, 4.07PM “This is very ungood.”

Talking to our son in the Pilbara this afternoon, they are all watching it. Has that feel about it.

Liebor is about to be caught with its pants down.

Boambee John
Boambee John
March 13, 2024 8:13 pm

Bruce of Newcastle
Mar 13, 2024 7:08 PM

The Brits also claimed their officer class was incompetent.

Um yes, yes they were. Until Monash. Who wasn’t a Pom.

Of course Monash learned from Brusilov…who was a Russian.

Let’s not get too parochial, the Canadian Arthur Currie was a corps commander before Monash. Currie had visited and learned a lot from the French, particularly lessons from Verdun.

On the British side, Plumer and Maxse had good reputations, and Cavan, even as a corps commander, stood up to Haig and refused to mount one of the November 1916 attacks on the Somme.

And try not to overlook “Hooky” Walker, who commanded the 1st Australian Division from late 1915 until well into 1918, to the great satisfaction of his troops.

JC
JC
March 13, 2024 8:16 pm

I think it’s heading into the 90s, MareeS. Has that feel that it’s going down hard, but I really have no insight and just an observer because I’m carrying a large short Aussie dollar position against the US$

will
will
March 13, 2024 8:16 pm

miltonf
Mar 13, 2024 7:52 PM
So Toowoomba might finally get a decent rail connection to Brissie.

is there an indecent one?

I doubt any train could handle the gradient of the toowoomba range

Roger
Roger
March 13, 2024 8:17 pm

Liebor is about to be caught with its pants down.

Jim ‘ll fix it.

Cough.

Roger
Roger
March 13, 2024 8:20 pm

I doubt any train could handle the gradient of the toowoomba range

They did it in 1867.

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