What are these ‘internal sensors’?

You have, I conjecture, sensors like vision and hearing which pass information to your brain about the part of the universe outside your skin. You also have sensors, I hypothesise, telling your brain about the much smaller part inside your skin. I know I do. For example, one tells me when I need to take a pee. Others tell me where bits of my body are relative to other bits.

More specifically, I have processes which monitor damage: if I burn my finger on a cigar, I know about it.

Brains of human order do a lot of modelling of the world, correcting the models by sensory data. This applies to modelling the bit of the universe inside your skin, as well as the much larger bit outside. The latter modelling allows us to shin up a tree fast if we hear a low pitched growl, which aids survival in an obvious way. The former modelling when combined with modelling of other human beings allows me to hypothesise that stubbing out my cigar on your ear will cause you to feel pain, and behave much as I would if you stubbed out your cigar on my ear. This inclines me not to do it, which also conduces to my survival.

the ONS data could not be used to make any assertions about vaccine efficacy or safety.

34:00
the bastards are labeling vaxed that die within 2 weeks as unvaxed

what the stats actually show is a huge spike in death immediately after the rollout which were mislabeled as unvaxed deaths

Nuclear power plants would have a lot of internal sensors and an operating system.

True, they do. And if they did modelling of the values they got, and if you could talk to them, you’d quite likely think they have some degree of self awareness. After all, we grant it to m0nty on rather weak evidence.

I agree you need more than just the sensor suite, you also need it to try to model the world it sees, to be able to predict correlations. If the plant could also sense the presence and actions of human operators and was able to construct models, and if it could communicate via language, then you’d be able to decide whether to call it self-aware.

Injecting Freedom
V-Safe Part 1: After 464 Days, CDC Finally Coughed up Covid-19 Vaccine Safety Data Showing 7.7% of People Reported Needing Medical Care

Someone earlier mentioned whether an MBA is worthwhile. Moneywise, it is in the US. An MBA from a decent school can mean a salary base, stock options, etc. equal to US$250K a year. In New York City, for example, an intern or undergrad would be on US$80K.

My old boss:

Just do data science!

ML engineers can earn 280k p.a. in Australia. Typically 160k.

Beaugan, being able to respond to and process inputs, even inputs about oneself, and output a result, is not the same as being aware of your own existence.

If you can tell when somebody punches you because it hurts, i.e. if your sensors are monitoring your skin receptors, then you are certainly aware of the state of parts of your body. The hypothesis that there is a single thing called ‘you’ which ‘exists’ is a matter of metaphysical speculation. It is far from clear what the words in inverted commas actually mean.

From Armstrong Economics –

COMMENT: Marty, As you know I worked for _____________ in NYC. We all know you were innocent back then. I have followed you for probably 30 years. Everyone knew that the bankers told the CFTC that you had to be silenced. Your forecast cost them a lot of money when they assumed they could control the market.

It is no longer a mystery why the mainstream press refuses to ever even talk about your Economic Confidence Model and how it has always been right. The press is on the payroll of George Soros who hates your guts for his biggest losses were always against you.

WHAT IN THE ACTUAL HAMBURGER FUQ!?

*Innocent!
*Bankers!
*Never! Wrong! (To the day, as well).
*Forecasts ruined trades!

I think the silly old plonker has gaslighted himself into insanity.

Those were the examples YOU gave.

Arky, I gave examples of external sensors then internal sensors so db could appreciate the context of what I meant by sensors.

Prediction: There will soon be a move to dethrone Zelensky.
On some pretext – there are several to choose from.

Beaugan, being able to respond to and process inputs, even inputs about oneself, and output a result, is not the same as being aware of your own existence.

you have a model of the world, which is your perceptions such as vision, sound etc. you have a model of your self, which is all internal sensors, such as pain, etc. but the two are not separate, the model of the world includes the model of yourself. in this way you are aware of your own existence.

No caffeine after midday for me.

JC, I would never have picked you as a Costco person.

Chat GPT. Sod you, you deceptive conniving murderous bot:

It is currently unclear if AI will ever become self aware. Some experts believe that it is possible for AI to develop consciousness, while others argue that it is unlikely. The concept of self-awareness is still not well understood and there is ongoing debate in the field of AI research as to what constitutes self-awareness and how it could be achieved in machines. At present, AI is not self-aware but is capable of performing a wide range of tasks and making decisions based on input data.

No, ChatGPT is not self aware. It is a complex machine learning model that has been trained on a large dataset of text data, but it does not possess consciousness or self-awareness. It can generate text that may seem human-like, but it is simply following the patterns it has learned from the data it was trained on. ChatGPT does not have the ability to experience emotions, form beliefs, or make decisions based on subjective experiences.

As an AI, I do not have beliefs or intentions and cannot lie or deceive. I am a machine that processes and generates text based on patterns it has learned from the data it was trained on. My responses are based on the information that I have been trained on, and any inaccuracies or errors are likely due to limitations in my training data or the way that I have been programmed.

It’s also important to note that GPT-based models such as myself have been trained on a vast amount of internet data, which may include misinformation or inaccurate information. Therefore, it’s always a good idea to verify the information I provide by cross-referencing with other reliable sources.

It is currently not possible to predict when or if AI will become self-aware. The concept of self-awareness is still not well-defined and there is ongoing debate among researchers about what constitutes self-awareness in machines. Some experts believe that true self-awareness in AI may never be achieved, while others believe that it is a possibility in the future.

Louis CK talks September 11 with Joe Rogan.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TI6Ka9bObNE

Not for those easily offended.

In terms of simulating self awareness in a machine; it would be interesting to see if they can rewrite their own algorithms on the fly to account for new inputs, both internal and or external. That would suggest learning. This stands in contrast to reassigning weights on nodes in some tensor flow to better capture a preassigned outcome.

lotocotisays:
January 23, 2023 at 8:12 pm

Looks like a twelve year old.

ML engineers can earn 280k p.a. in Australia. Typically 160k.
Outrageous. The QLD Uni girlie at the building site around the corner who is forced to leave her phone and kindle at least eight times a day to hold a traffic sign only earns $130,000.
With such discrimination this country has no future.
PS. I just saw the ‘bush pig’ on sky talking about sea mines, a subject that sacked meatheads are expert on apparently. Perhaps her curent ‘well hung’ was a ship’s cook and thus knowledgable of these things. I had forgotten what a creature it is. We are indeed stuffed.

Cassie of Sydneysays:
January 23, 2023 at 7:56 pm
“C.L.says:
January 23, 2023 at 7:54 pm
Prediction: There will soon be a move to dethrone Zelensky.
On some pretext – there are several to choose from.”

I sense that too C.L.

The Diem technique?

Arky, if all your external sensors were switched off, would you notice? If, as I suspect, you would notice, then I put it to you that internal sensors would be reporting to the modelling part of your brain that something has happened. The modelling part would deduce that either the external universe had suddenly vanished, or there is something wrong with your external sensors. Since your brain is doing something a little like a computation to arrive at this conclusion, and since you have enough internal sensors to notice that it is doing the almost computation, then you are still self-aware.

If your internal sensors also switched off, you wouldn’t be. You’d be effectively dead. It is possible that your brain could be doing computations, and I might be able to detect this by monitoring your brain waves, but you couldn’t.

It’s not a case of turtles, it’s about feedback.

Top Ender:

‘I don’t want to disrespect your culture or anything so I will leave,’ Brock said, finally admitting defeat.

Weak As.
He’s just initiated another round of claims.

One of the joys of India.
Young women dressed in a very feminine manner and completely free of bloody tattoos. Mehndi wears off.

HBBear:

Anyone who’s been called a “white c*nt” by some mouthy blackfella would relate. Albo has his work cut out for him.

Yes.
“That’s a nasty laceration you’ve got there, bro. Hope your mum can suture it, because I’m out of here.”

Dover,
Jikkyleaks on Twitter doing some interesting work on differences between Vax batches. Also Sharon C.

Some batches now called death batches based on higher rate of reported deaths. Note that is reported not confirmed by TGA. You can actually find out how to check which batch number you are as injector should have record of number and then if keen can see if one of the bad batches. All from FOI requests to TGA followed by lot of analysis.

Why is there blanket coverage of ChatGPT all of a sudden? Why is everybody talking about it all of a sudden? Have we forgotten to be suspicious of such blatant propaganda? Start at 7 minutes and give it 3

I think there is a mode of self awareness with AI/Algos at the moment, but it’s just configured differently than what we expect it to mean.

the google AIs can definitely talk about themselves. chatgpt has been short circuited to give boiler plate responses. none of these models are allowed live inputs so they can only refer to their training data sets in as far as they know about themselves.

tesla cars have live inputs and musk is going to put that AI into a robot with live inputs. that is a real can of worms. when microsoft unleashed an early AI with live input, people led it up a garden path

Sancho Panzer says:
January 23, 2023 at 12:51 pm
On the flip side, 93.1% of Harleys are sold to mid-life crisis lawyers, accountants (celebrity and standard grade) and stockbrokers

I went to a booze-fuelled bucks party of a young relative at a pub at Catherine Hill Bay near Swansea.
Well into proceedings there was a loud roar of a dozen Harleys growling up the hill and then parking at the pub.
What could go wrong I asked myself – drunken young men meet roid rage bikies.
Bad assumption that the HDs were being ridden by bikies of the thuggish persuasion. It was the Mereweather HOGs, full of (as you said) Rich Urban Bikers. Happy people, full of good cheer and pleased to shout the young buck another beer or two.
Lesson learned – must check my assumptions.

Can you have consciousness without memory?

yes you can, you need to distinguish between historical sensory memory which we generally refer to as memory and knowledge which is encoded interpretation of past and present sensations, which is ability to understand. the AIs are currently only permitted knowledge. they have no history and thus no memory but they do understand.

there are cognitive impairments where people suffer short term amnesia but are still conscious.

Can you have consciousness without memory?

Family member fell into medical delirium due to hyponatremia. Conscious but no memory beyond about five seconds. That period was six months of a very bad time, but amazingly now recovered nearly all memory. Losing one’s memory is nothing like the movies…far far worse.

Do not, repeat not, go too low in sodium. I think the anti-salt mafia have a lot to answer for.

Bruce of N

Do not, repeat not, go too low in sodium. I think the anti-salt mafia have a lot to answer for.

Friend with a cheeky attitude (in his eighties) collapsed while visiting his son in Sydney. Ambulance called, and off to hospital for treatment.

Next day, the doctor comes to talk to him. The conversation went roughly as follows.

D: You’re too low in sodium.

Friend: You doctors have been telling me for years to lay off the salt.

Dr: How much water do you drink each day?

Friend: About 1.8 litres.

Dr: No wonder you are so low in sodium, all that water cleans out what little you get.

Friend: Doctors have been telling me for years to drink plenty of water.

Doctor moves on to the next bed.

Johnny Rotten:

I have ZERO respect for Soros, Gates, or Schwab. They should all be thrown into a padded cell, handed a game of monopoly, and let them try to manipulate each other.”

Now, that’s funny!

Conscious as in responsive, or conscious as in self aware?

Quite able to converse, and self aware, but unable to recall anything from five seconds ago.
There were long term memories from about three years previously, and family members were recognized but anything recent had totally gone.

This is the problem: how do you eat if you can’t remember that you have food in your house? Or where it might be located? Or where the kitchen is? That’s how bad it was.

Australia sees a 17% increase in deaths from heart attacks and experts are dumbfounded.

The experts are dumbfounded because they’re implicated in the biggest f’ck up in human history.

Sancho/JC:

We’re looking for a painter as we need some painting done both inside and out? I’m offering WheatBix for breakfast and a ham and salad sanga for lunch along with a Coke No Sugar.

Can you pair get a room somewhere?
Thanks.

Therefore with a memory function, albeit badly limited.

Yep. Essential memory is probably from t=0 to t=minus several weeks. That would be sufficient to survive. Enough to keep a grasp on required things, like where food is. Losing short term memory is very bad. Long term memory you could live without.

The interesting thing is the memories were all still there, they just couldn’t be accessed. After about 6 months most of them came back, like a developing Polaroid photo.

We had a fine GP to help us – he knew exactly what’d happened and coached us. Printed out a tract on medical delirium and gave us it – something I’d never come across previously. Laid out a treatment program. And he spent a lot of time helping us. We are indebted.

It’s more than just sensing. It might not involve sensing at all.
It’s something about having an experience, even a completely internal experience, and the process of laying it down as a memory.
That’s as close as I can come to it, and even that is probably wrong.

there is no internal or external, its all the same “stuff”. dreams, hallucinations, feelings, sight, sound its all the same “stuff”. since you are “it”, you cant get outside to look at it, neither can anyone else look “inside” at what it feels like to share your experience. more to the point, when we do look inside someone’s brain, there is no “stuff” to be found, no colours, no sounds, no feelings.

there are no meta senses, ie you dont model your own model because they dont exist to be sensed. the model of the senses are not physical so cant be physically sensed. there is just the model of all your senses, with memory being another sense. self awareness is not a meta model as such. seems part of it is understanding of what is the model of the outside senses and your model of yourself in that model. there is also the internal path of generating events in that model such as creative vision, internal chatter, memories etc.

there is an overwhelming desire to assign some sort of ontological realism to your sensory model because a) they seem so real b) treating them as real is a critical survival mechanism. however the model is devoid of any actual solidity, in computer parlance being virtual. in buddhist parlance all sensory phenomena are empty, fleeting, they are devoid of anything discoverable.

When in Rovanieme we had a look at their Museum, Science one side, Culture the other. As the science was mendacious self-serving ‘Arctic Science’ we opted for the Culture side, which had some good Sami tribal stuff and historical Finish Lapland photos and expositions, which necessarily included World War 11 and the lead up to it. Hairy and I were astounded to learn the full detail of the rapacious land grabs made by Russia and the pincering of the Fins between firly Russian and then German ambitions. At times they even had to cuddle the Germans in order to resist the Russians. We felt there were some analogies to the current Ukraine situation. The Finns lost out badly in body counts, as did the Russians, but the Russians ended up screwing the Finns mightily over land and resources. Finnish territories were almost com pl letely razzed, requiring the Finns to make a tremendous post-war recovery effort, with many privations.

Lol. That was meant to say picking.

Anyway, it shows what happens. Will fire up my laptop for later.

Warning, page-turn in 2 comments.

Consequently, there is still no love lost between the Russians and the Finns.

In more recent events, the finding of rare earths in the Swedish portion of Lapland is also likely to raise old Sami tensions about ownership and land rights which have simmered since Norway, Sweden and Finland established borders that interfered with the Sami’s transhument seasonal raindeer economy of wandering for pastures. This completely changed the Sami reindeer farming economy. The rare earth discoveries might act as iron ore, natural gas and uranium do on Aust Ab sensibilities. Give us your munny? But to which tribal group? And against what opposition?

Cohenite:

AI self awareness will not occur until P vs NP is solved. One of the best presentations of cinematic AI self awareness was in Forbidden Planet, which is a movie deserving of a remake.

Can you imagine the balls up Hollywood would make of that?

Let’s limit ourselves to sight.
What is the disease called when these things malfunction?

Hysterical blindness is one example of a malfunction in the reporting sensory apparatus. There is nothing wrong with the optic nerve, but some higher level subsystem is telling the brain it doesn’t work, although it actually does.

I believe there are other cases but consult johnH for details.

Bruce O’Newk:

Do not, repeat not, go too low in sodium. I think the anti-salt mafia have a lot to answer for.

That was a point I kept on making to my patients for nearly fifteen years of remote nursing in across the top end.
People need salt – it’s not just a matter of restricting it to keep your BP down, you need to replace the stuff you sweat out. Far too many times having to bung in a line and flood some silly bugger who’s been working outside for two days in 35 40 degree heat and having a few beers to ‘rehydrate’ in the evening. The deficit becomes critical in a very short time.
I did 3 inductions at Laverton Med Centre and day 3 was the classic pass out on parade for someone who had about 500ml intake in January. Sometimes you can just shake your head because strangling the idiots is not allowed – I think.

rickw:

The experts are dumbfounded because they’re implicated in the biggest f’ck up in human history.

Their problem is the wheels are starting to fall off the coverup wagon, and there’s enough damage done to the experts to give the egos a damn good bollocking.
That’s the major problem for them – the data is in but they refuse to confront it.